DMG to include a "starter town".

[The Little Raven]

I use to heavily demo for White Wolf, back in the day, starting with Kindred of the East, and the fan-downloadable stuff is a lot more up to snuff with what we use to be given to do demos.

Yeah, I used to run a Wolf Pack down here, too. It was how I got into the Trinity games, as they sent me copies and told me to get people playing.

 

[MichaelSomething]

I think that the best place for a starter town and starter adventure would be the DnD Insider Wizards of the Coast is trying to sell. Those would be perfect web extras/articles.

 

[Friadoc]

Personally I feel they should put a "starter town" in a web-enhancement and use those pages in the DMG for something more valuable, like guidelines governing undersea adventures.

Now, you see, I've always been of the opinion that while they should do a quick few pages on handling exotic locales for an adventure, such as undersea or what not, I've always felt that those should have their own book since the majority of people might not use it.

While using a web-enhancement to supplement a book, especially the DMG, is a good idea, I think putting stuff that would be how-to for a new DM/GM would be the wrong way to go.

In fact, it'd almost be more appropriate for a more fully fleshed outline and guidelines for running an undersea campaign to be a web enhancement since it could be expanded from a brief outline in the DMG and is something that would benefit the most people, as it would cut down on those who would say "They wasted pages on this undersea stuff!", yet also cutdown on "Where's the love for undersea adventures?".

As I've said previously, I'm a firm believer that all RPGs need in the main "Game Runner Books" a section on how to run the game, not only the mechanics, but how to make your own adventures, locations, plotting, et al, since it gives people the tools to become a person who runs a game and without this section we're likely to reduce the people who make that jump.

While my experience might differ from others, I will say that a lot of people that I've seen who go from not being "the game runner" to running games have done it with the assistance of just such sections and enjoyed things even more when there were examples of how to make or create things.

The 1st Edition AD&D DMG had a lot of this stuff and it worked for people, since they're going to have to learn somewhere, right?

 

[delericho]

Even if I am mistaken, a pamphlet-sized adventure module + pregens + town, handed out gratis in gaming stores with the PHB , would be both brilliant and easy.

Agreed, except on one detail: hand it out with the DMG, or even better, hand out one with every core rulebook. Or, if the printing costs are prohibitive, at least make such a thing available online, without a DI subscription.

 

[Friadoc]

Yeah, I used to run a Wolf Pack down here, too. It was how I got into the Trinity games, as they sent me copies and told me to get people playing.

You mean Aeon, right? *grins*

Sorry, I just never put that silly Trinity sticker on my main binder book, as I thought Viacom was just a huge bunch of idiots for trying to establish the rights to a word that was not only in the dictionary, but also part of a religions name.

Feh. Jerks.

But, back then, White Wolf couldn't take the fight too them, as they did with Underworld/Sony.

Anyhow, enough threadjacking. Sorry. But, Aeon was an awesome setting that I think would have gotten a better chance had it not been for the lawsuit stunting the launch.

 

[Friadoc]

I think that the best place for a starter town and starter adventure would be the DnD Insider Wizards of the Coast is trying to sell. Those would be perfect web extras/articles.

Not really, since the whole nature of a starter thing is for someone that is a neonate to the game, or at least not that devoted, yet, so they are less likely to have said subscription.

Maybe back when Dungeon and Dragon were in print, since it was easier for a curious player to look at the magazine rack and say, "Why not", but with it in electronic format the impulse buy is pretty much gone.

Without the leverage of an in print source for introduction on gamecraft, I seriously think that the ratio of curious-to-game-runner conversions is going to lessen.

Now I won't say they won't happen, especially if they have a solid game runner who will suggest things for them to read, but it won't be as ease-of-use as it currently is.

 

[The Little Raven]

But, Aeon was an awesome setting that I think would have gotten a better chance had it not been for the lawsuit stunting the launch.

Agreed. I'd like to see them revise it for a second edition and set it up as a lulu.com PoD book like they did with MET Awakening.

Anyway, back to our regularly scheduled discussion.

 

[Reaper Steve]

I think that the best place for a starter town and starter adventure would be the DnD Insider Wizards of the Coast is trying to sell. Those would be perfect web extras/articles.

I disagree. This belongs in the DMG, and they would be remiss not to include it.
Why? Well, the title is Dungeon Master's Guide... it needs to live up to that name.
3E finally made made it so all the rules needed to play were in the PHB, and the DMG supplemented that.
The 4E DMG needs to take at a step further and truly be more of a guide. Sure it will have supplementary rules, like encounter design, town design, and adventure design, but then it should also provide guidance to the DM (as the name says) on actually using them.

 

[dmccoy1693]

I think that the best place for a starter town and starter adventure would be the DnD Insider Wizards of the Coast is trying to sell. Those would be perfect web extras/articles.

Maybe, it would sure would be nice if there was a single tome that could ... guide ... a young dungeon master in everything they needed to know in being a dungeon master as well as provided examples. Such a ... guide ... could also be a place for experienced dungeon masters to have as a quick reference when they want to make their own and not verbatium use someone else's work without the experienced DM having to go out and buy more stuff. This ... guide ... could also serve as a standardized format for all 3rd party companies in which which to follow.

If only there was such a ... guide. hmmmm.

 

[billd91]

And for the life of me, I can't fathom why people don't want examples of towns or dungeons in a book called The Dungeon Master's Guide. The original 1e DMG had an example dungeon (unfinished) and an example play session (unfinished). It also had a list of all MM monsters in list form that was a colossal waste of space that would've been far better spent fleshing out both examples. Never mind all this rubbish about "hand holding." Give me an example of a town that'll inspire me. That sounds like 10 to 20 (or more!) pages well spent.

Hear, hear!

I notice that most of the discussion about iconic towns doesn't include much reference to FR. Why not Shadowdale? I'm no Elminster or FR fan, but wouldn't that count as iconic?

For what it's worth, I'd bet on classic Hommlet or the Keep on the Borderlands being the iconic town.