DMs: Are you a "plot-nazi"?

[Mouseferatu]

It's important to remember that including a story does not always equate to being a plot-nazi or to railroading.

My campaigns usually have overriding plot arcs. That's not to say that every game is involved in that plot, but the plot is always there in the background, and is always advanced every few games. (For an example, look at a TV series like Babylon 5.)

But...

I do not remove the players' free will. If they follow the plot hooks, great. If not, well, they may not be in a position to stop something nasty from happening, but they'll get to do other stuff instead.

Or, even more frequently, I have basic plot points imagined, but I work them in when and how it best suits what the players are doing. Avoided that really cool story idea I had because they went to one kingdom instead of the other? No problem. I'll either save it, and use it later, or I'll rework it so I can run it where they are now.

So yes, I've got a story, and some of it's even planned out, but I mold it, reshape it, and change it as needed to fit the players' actions, not the other way around.

None of that, as I see it, is railroading. Refusing to let the PCs make a difference, changing the rules because they "must" be captured for the plot to advance, refusing to let really well-planned tactics work just because they might kill an "important" NPC--that is evil.

Having the basic elements and major plot points of a story planned ahead of time is fine, if you're able to change it on the fly and let the players decide how/when/if elements of it creep into the campaign.

And by the way--I don't think there's anything wrong with upping a monster's hit points on the fly to create more epic combat, if you're doing it because you honestly made a mistake in choosing the monster in the first place because you overestimated it. It's also okay if you think the players are going to be bored if the fight's too easy--and believe me, that can happen. Doing it just because the players are getting lucky or because they outsmarted you, however, is not cool.

 

[Oogar]

Not.

Some players need a stronger sense of direction then others, I have noticed that. If they foil a plan, walk away from a hook, wander away from a story that is going on in the realm I don't really mind.

I do like for them to know what THEY want, in character and as players. I expect them to be able to deal with the repercussions of the free will that they use, and not complain if Fred the High Priest won't raise your friend after you spit in his face.

When my current game started, I knew very few things. I knew a villian, had a vague Idea about 3 story threads that would be happening, and one town. Those things are still developing, and many other things are happening as well. The PC's have changed some things, and left others to play out. It could all be interesting in the end.

Wouls like to say more, but one or two of my players read the boards.

 

[The Forsaken One]

Well not much to say exept that I have 4 players and they are all very very intelligent and yes I am a plot Nazi but I just never ever have to force them to follow my plot.

They sit down and brain storm and think and think some more. And I love it as they always find the right solution, they just always walk the path I want them to, sometiems they go abit astray but they always find their way back to the plot.

No DM forcefullness required, just nice casual gaming. We had a DM who played freeestyle, but everyone complained about a good story or plot. We had one with a good story and plot but just hack and slash. And at the moment I'm offering them more puzzles and plots and NPC interacting then real combat.

Everyone is enjoying themselves to the max since they are soo happy to finally see the use of skills and charisma (w000t!! That that day would ever come) and they are really fond of puzzles and interrogations and smart conversations. I think my players are rather good and they enjoy this subtle gaming style and they like to stick with the plot and follow the story. Since they learned it lead to fun, intelligent challenges and something to crack your mind on. Not just to crack your 15 clubs on 15 troll heads.

Last session they faced off with some very powerfull opponents and the fight ended with a few running off, you should have seen the delight expressed on their faces to see opponents cleverly played. The ranger paired of with a wizard to track one guy down who ran off into the woods and our two rogues (a dungeon delver and a spymaster) faced off with 3 guys in the castle. No real face off, just plain smart hit and run tactics and you will learn to fear to look around the corner and some really really smart tactics fr in a castle. It was hectic, it was mania and the other guys tracked the other guy down (over a period of a whole day).

They were delighted to finally see some action but they were glad to be presented with some mysterious books, letters and scrolls and something secret in the castle and the village at the lake.

But back to the thread point. I don't need to force them to follow my plot. Since it appeals to much to them that they like o follow it since they know it brings good, enjoyable and challenging gameplay. I had one player who just tried to keep rining my plots and to wrack everything, I just banned him from my game. Call it extreme but it lead to this now and we have great great fun. I love to see my players sweat and works their way through plots. But they get there! And that is my greatest reward as a DM to know you made it just as tough as you could and they did it all on their own. And they played your story because they want to play it because its good fun and a challenge.

 

[CRG]

I do a combination of all of these things.

First, I have an overall story/arc/whatever that will be happening in the background in which hopefully the party will want to participate. Some adventures may be keyed to or important to this arc eventually, even if the PCs don't want to participate directly..."What? you mean that holy avenger we donated to the temple was just destroyed by evil-bastard-warlord-bob?"

Second, I tend to create things and throw them out there with hooks. The players can do whatever they want, using the hooks as a basis..."Trolls under the bridges in New York. Lost temple rumored to be in a forest here. Strange woman lying in a pond distributing magical swords found here." They investigate and handle as they wish.

Third, I build enough background into the key groups and people so the party can participate with them.

Fourth, and this is key, for each NPC - whether I decided they were important in the beginning, like the old healer in the local temple who I named "John Doe" and is a former adventurer, versus "some guy who runs a tavern" - I keep an index card. For instance, the healer "John Doe" who I think will be important and with whom they may interact would have a card I create in adance - describes what he looks like, how he talks, what his interests are. The "guy who runs the tavern" may not have a card, or a name. The problem is, there is no telling when a PC will want to strike up a detailed conversation, make a friend, etc. I ad-hoc those things on the fly and scribble as quickly as a can on the index card so that the NEXT time the PCs talk to that NPC, I know his name, personality, likes, dislikes, etc. Heck, before a session I might flip through the cards and add a note if something happens to the NPC - his daughter gets married, he gets killed in a bar fight, he inherits a sum of money, etc. That way the NPC develops and the PCs get a sense that time in this world is moving forward.

This index card thing has saved me a bazillion times. you can add to NPC cards or create new ones on the fly as necessary (and it is necessary). Then, when there is nothing going on you can plan new plots and events for the PCs to stumble into or plan out reactions as they do things differently.

Above all, when dealing with your main plot remember this:

Nothing can be made fool-proof as fools are so ingenius.

 

[Renaissance Man]

I used to be such a plot-nazi that once I discovered the error of(and mended) my ways, my players still refused to believe that they had complete control of their characters. I still get vacant looks from them from time to time. (Hearkening back to another thread, the players "search the room for the plot", convinced that there's something they're missing.)

 

[jester47]

I am not a plot nazi.

I have about four things going on in the world that the heroes seem to come across time and again. Depending on how the heroes handle it, determines what will happen next week. I present situations. Typically it is: This is the situation... how do you react? A good example of what my situations are like is the scene in LotR:FotR where Gandalf goes to see saruman. Their reactions do have an effect on the world. I know some of my characters if presented with the situation in FotR would have hooked up with Saruman....

Aaron.

 

[Gothmog]

I am not, nor have I ever been a plot-nazi. Although I do admit starting out as a hard-core dungeon-delver, hack-n-slasher. I think that railroading is probably the worst thing a DM can do, because it makes the players feel like they have no control over their actions or the outcomes of their adventures. I think everyone here could see how frustrating that would be.

A few years ago I agree to play in the campaign of a friend I had known since high school. He had DMed a lot before when he was in college, so I thought he should have a good grasp of how to do things, and it would be fun. Turned out he was the biggest plot-nazi I had ever heard of. Before every session, he would write a prologue he would read aloud to us about the adventure, and expect us not to use any info we learned there (which is good, but I and most of the other players would have rather learned the info during play, rather than have it scripted to us). The plots of the adventure were set in stone, so that no matter what manner of travel we used, it always took the same amount of time to reach a destination. If a player figured out an ingenious way to get at the heart of the problem, he would be told flatly that it didn't work, despite the fact the rules said otherwise (and often with this DM changing the rules during the session to that plans would no work). Players who displeased the DM were subject to "grudge monsters"- critters who were unleashed on the party, but somehow all managed to attack the offending character. In fact, there was a standing joke in the game that whenever an NPC would start a long speech, someone would say "Look out, here comes the plot wagon!". The DM never understood that comment, mostly because he was busy flirting with one of the female players and missed the original reference. Another time, he had scripted for the king of a country to land the killing blow on a badass invading evil general. One of the PCs used a poisoned sword of sharpness and managed to land a critical hit potent enough to kill the guy. Reeling, the DM said we had killed the guy's armor, and now his armor decayed into rust!!! Regarless of player action, the adventures would end just as he had scripted them.

Later we learned that he only ran the campaign so he could wirte books about the characters and adventures. He even told us he loved the dialogue of our characters in his story!?!? Because he was a a friend, none of us really wanted to tell him his campiagn was lame, but players missed sessions all the time due to boredom or lack of interest.

That game just left a very bad taste in my mouth, and to this day I cannot abide a plot-nazi. I know plot-nazis come in varying degrees, but I guess I have seen the worst there is.

 

[Nightfall]

I don't know about Plot Nazi but I'm into plots. They help keep things going, especially if there are NPCs involved. Life IS a story. We tell our kids and friends of things that happen to us. Some times they seem unbelieveable or incomprehenible, but they DO happen. Some times the story has to be given to the PCs but let's face it, PCs want two things in life, that I've noticed, gold and magic stuff. To me, I'd hope they'd want more...but it's often not the case.

Case in point: I ran Death in Freeport. If I had known then what I know now about the place, it might have remained in tact...maybe. That said, I saw the entire plot go to hell just because the darn NPC didn't help out. Proving once again, PCs are pretty DARN unpredictable.

 

[Zappo]

I sometimes plot-nazi, sometimes I don't, sometimes I just sit at the table and say "What are you going to do today?"

It's just like IRL. Sometimes you just have to do certain things... but not always.

I will heavily plot-nazi only when I know that if the players kill the plot I will be out of ideas for the rest of the session.

 

[Squire James]

I'm somewhat of a plot-a-holic, but not to extent that anyone outside of a message-board has called me a Nazi (if you haven't noticed, it's pretty easy to be called a Nazi on a message-board, especially if you're arguing politics).

Unfortunately, many "classic" modules that are considered "good" are actually plot railroads of the highest order. Think about everything Tracy Hickman got his hands on (Dragonlance, Ravenloft, Desert of Desolation series)... good stories, good modules, BAD railroads! Think about that last Slave Lords module... if you're there you're probably railroaded (any Slave Lord with a brain would have simply killed the PC's).

So there was apparently a time when plot railroading was considered GOOD, and now the "classic DM's" have to unlearn most of what they've learned. Sometimes, that isn't easy!