Do archfiends grant spells in your campaigns? And if so how?

[Trickstergod]

I voted that they can't grant spells, though clerics of evil gods might have them as patrons. At least not in any setting where there's some sort of difference between them and evil gods. I find making the separation redundant if they grant spells. They may as well be evil gods, or the evil gods archfiends, if they both do the same sort of thing. Only, what, archfiends don't need worshippers? That's crazy talk, then. I prefer my deities to be deities, not some lesser being lower on the food chain (which is what I got a sense of when I read the Book of Vile Darkness).

So either the archfiends are one and the same as evil gods (and either aren't referred to as archfiends, or the evil gods are also referred to as archfiends), or they're not, in which case, they don't grant spells. Usually, I just keep them as archfiends, potent, but not god-like, the servitors and creations of evil gods.

 

[d4]

i can't recall ever using archfiends in any of my D&D campaigns, but if i did i wouldn't have them granting spells.

usually, i just have fiends serving evil gods the way celestials serve good gods. since they are just servitor entities, they don't have any worshippers of their own. if there are unique, powerful fiends, they are just the most powerful of the servants of the evil gods. i don't have them being a power structure independent of the gods.

 

[Li Shenron]

Whatever your choice is, your campaign is going to be fine.

The most common choice in D&D settings is to have both evil deities and archfiends, that's typical of D&D which tries to incorporate everything for every possible source. Homebrew campaigns and adventures are often more based on archfiends since they are more popular in real life religions than evil gods.

I think that you don't really need to choose until either one of your players wishes to play a Cleric of the cult of an archfiend or you want to have such character as a NPC. You won't be going against the rules if you allow such a Cleric, since it won't be different from a god-less Cleric which is allowed.

To be honest, it doesn't really matter even if divine spells are "granted" by a deity or a simply the result of the character's faith and belief.
In fact consider these: are Druids and Rangers granted powers by a deity at all? how come that a deity actually grants spells to thousands of clerics even if he is not himself able to cast them?

To sum up, don't be stressed by the fact that the author wrote in the books that "deities grant spells", you don't have to take it strictly if it bothers you, at least it has not the rights to prevent you running the campaign as you wish.

 

[Goobermunch]

I like the idea that Archfiends can't grant spells on their own. But, being exceptionally powerful, they capture demigods and torture them to reach the desired result. Just fear the day that one escapes . . . .

--G

 

[Psion]

I went with "other".

Archfiend (demon prince, whatever) and deity are essentially separate determinations. Some archfiends can grant spells, some can't. But generally, the more powerful a demon prince is, the more likely that they are also classified as a divine power of some sort.

 

[hong]

Ever watched the anime The Slayers? In it, a main character regularly pledges herself to dark forces for powerful destructive magic. I've considered using something like that in my games, but it's only come up with villains, so I've never had to flesh out the rules.

Basically, the demon would exact some sort of tithe from the petitioner, probably in the form of a part of their soul, or XP. So the spellcaster performs a ritual, makes a modified character level + Charisma check (DC = 10 + spell level), and if she succeeds, she pays XP equal to twice the cost of an equivalent spell scroll. The ritual takes 1 round per spell level, and if she's interrupted and fails a Concentration check, the spellcaster suffers some nastiness. Typically, she takes 1d6 points of damage per spell level, but other stuff could happen, like the spell being misdirected, or the demon itself showing up. If the mage is killed by a backfired spell in this way, her soul is taken by the demon she was pledging herself to.

This is 90% twaddle. Slayers is basically D&D turned up to eleven, and its magic by and large follows D&D tradition: Lina Inverse and her friends throw around ra tilts, elmekia lances, fireballs, freeze arrows, etc with great abandon, and with scarcely any thought for consequences. Even the dragon slave, supposedly the "most powerful black magic spell known" that can kill dragons and level villages, is trucked out regular as clockwork, once per episode; sometimes twice. As far as can be told, Lina never suffers any ill-effects for casting a dragon slave.

The only spells that appear to pose a significant risk to the caster are the giga slave, and _maybe_ the ragna blade. Two spells (that are effectively plot devices) out of maybe 90 or more do not a risky spell system make.

 

[diaglo]

This is 90% twaddle. Slayers is basically D&D turned up to eleven

can i say i'm glad i don't have a clue as to what you are talking about.

and i'm pretty sure you know what i mean.

Ooi "not an anime fan at all" diaglo

 

[hong]

can i say i'm glad i don't have a clue as to what you are talking about.

and i'm pretty sure you know what i mean.

Ooi "not an anime fan at all" diaglo

Slayers is a parody of the stereotypical D&D campaign featuring super-powerful magic, a munchkinny main character and an oddball cast of supporting characters, much pratfalling, and quests to Save The World. Much of it is comedy, but it gets all serious towards the end of each series, as the imperative to Save The World takes precedence over Killing Monsters and Taking Their Stuff.

It has been said that Lodoss War is the anime that D&D gamers aspire to, while Slayers is what they actually achieve. Bollocks to that, says I. Slayers is a _far_ more worthy target to aspire to.

 

[diaglo]

It has been said that Lodoss War is the anime that D&D gamers aspire to, while Slayers is what they actually achieve. Bollocks to that, says I. Slayers is a _far_ more worthy target to aspire to.

okay now you are scaring me.

i've seen Low dross Wars. and i'll just say no one should aspire to such a low level of gaming. no one. not even Wuxians.

 

[hong]

okay now you are scaring me.

i've seen Low dross Wars. and i'll just say no one should aspire to such a low level of gaming. no one. not even Wuxians.

Well, let's just say I'm not a fan of Low Dross Wars either.

Lodoss : Slayers :: Kalamar : Hackmaster


Hong "not dissing Kalamar" Ooi