Do archfiends grant spells in your campaigns? And if so how?

[Dakkareth]

And if someone is really sweating how fiends do their thing, just tell them they really don't want to know.

Are you going to take a level of Alienist then? No? Because that's, where such questions will lead you.
(Paraphrased after WizarDru's SH)

In the setting I'm trying to build somewhen there are two types of clerics. One is the Magepriest, who works mostly like a DnD cleric and the other is the Cultist, who works differently.

The Magepriest is effectively a wizard who gains his ability to cast spells from serving a god instead of learning how to access the power of magic themselves. They learn to shape magical energy in the same way as wizards, but to get it, they must call upon their god.

The Cultist doesn't care for the how and why of magic, he simply calls to his god and he does something for them (or not), if they pay the prize. Effectively the god casts the spell, not the Cultist. This is not a class one would take as main class - the prize (XP-cost for every spell) would be too high (unless you're a madman making human sacrifices and raving about the infinite power of your patron). In this sense the name Cultist is badly chosen. Instead one would take levels of Cultist beside the normal class - combine a fighter with a Cultist of a Good patron and you have a paladin, combine a rogue with a Cultist of an evil god and you have your spellcasting assassin.

There can be Magepriests only of true gods. Cultists can derive their power from any source powerful enough - like Archfiends. So someone getting his spells from an archfiend would have levels of Cultist and pay XP/Blood/whatever for having his patron cast spells for him.

 

[Alaric_Prympax]

I voted Archfiends are effectively gods and grant spells.

My question, what is the problem with this option? Are there any reasons that can't be the case?

That said, I'm a bit of an oldtimer who still refers to the 1e Deities and Demigods which said Demon Princes, Archdevils, and so forth are Lesser Gods. I never really changed from that.

That about sums up my opinion as well. Thanks for writing it for me!

 

[Olive]

Ohhh, I knew I forgot an option: what about the thurmatagist core class from GR's armies of the abyss? That's kind of in between some of the options on the poll...

I wonder of the book of fiends will allow daemons and devils to have thurmatagist worshippers as well?

 

[frankthedm]

Some potent demons and dragons can grant spells. For weaker ones, they have to pay [xp] for thier followers to get such spells. The greater ones are strong enough to bypass such costs. Here is a list of the major divine antagonists, not all are evil, but most are at ends with the goals of the typical pcs in my games.


En Sabbah Neur: Bæl of the desert sands. CN Domains Strength Chaos. FavWpn: Greatsword Holy Symbol: G. Sword thrust downward into the Chaos Star- A pc created this demi god for my game. Patron to the barbarian tribes cast out from the major desert civilizations. In life was reviled for his horrid appearance.

Behemoth: The Destroyer: N ("favors" Chaos/favors Evil) Domains: Strength, Destruction FavWpn: any, Symbol: Ruined city. Somehow the Tarrasque grants spells to those whose madness is strong enough.

Devil worshiper: “We like to keep our secrets.” –Asmodeous. Several can grant spells but details are only available through lifetimes of infernal paperwork, direct personal requests...or high risk field study.

Dragon cultist: alignment must match dragons. Domains: choose from dragon you worship. FavWpn. Natural attack or any Claw. Holy symbol: varies, Examples below
Tiamat: Mother of evil wyrms LE Domains Law, Evil. Holy symbol 5 headed dragon. Big momma is not the only evil dragon taking on worshipers.

Gruumsh: The all seeing lord of the Orcs., NE Domains Evil, Strength, War, Destruction. FavWpn any spear Holy Symbol: An orcish eye.


Orcus: Demon lord of undeath. CE Domains; Chaos, Death, Destruction, Evil, Trickery. FavWpn. mace. Holy symbol wand of Orcus (skull headed mace) Everyone's fav

Tawil At' Umar. (Ta-wil at UU-mar) The Dweller at the Gate. Patron of arcane magic. CN Domains: Chaos, Dimensions, Knowledge, Magic, Trickery, FavWpn staff Holy symbol. A swirling Gate with a key in the middle. wants to make the material world more accesable...

Yenoghu: Lord of Gnolls. God of bloodlust and cannibalism, Domains: Animal, Chaos, Evil, War FavWep. any flail -Holy Symbol: an eviscerated corpse.

 

[Jolly Giant]

IMC, I've made the major arch-fiends more powerful by giving them class levels, mainly the ones from Fiend Folio.

The most powerful ones have levels in the Fiend of Blasphemy class and can thus grant some spells. The class limits the fiend to granting spells of level 6 or lower (as per FF), but if they manage to gain enough followers to believe in them and make sacrifices in their name, they might start to gain divine ranks. So far, none of them has made it past divine rank zero.

As for the thaumaturgist, that class has so far only seen use as one single NPC (a kobold! ), but my ruling is that the thaumaturgist gets his spells from a deity that "sponsors" the arch-fiend in question. (Just like that gnoll-"deity" who's name escapes me at the moment is in fact sponsored by Erythnul.)

 

[BOZ]

En Sabbah Neur

Apocalypse?

 

[Olive]

bump for the monday crowd...

 

[Remathilis]

I treat all demon/monster/celestial/dragon cults as alignment clerics, granting them domains either by the BoVD or BoED or (in the case of Bahamut and Tiamat, who are not divine IMC) as if they were deities. However, they are really no different than a cleric devoted to law or good, or some abstract principle.

 

[Calico_Jack73]

You don't exactlly have to explain why Archfiends can grant spells if you want them to be able to in your campaign. It is your campaign, do what you want. Typically the Archfiends predate gods in any campaign world. Azmodeus and Orcus are the same in any campaign setting. The only god that accomplishes that is Correllon Latherian (I may be wrong but I don't have my books with me). Their survival and power doesn't have anything to do with the number of worshipers that they have, that is a limitation of the gods... Archfiends are independently powerful though in most cases aren't as powerful as gods. Therein lies the balance. Sure, Asmodeus could physically manifest in any campaign setting but the instant that he did the good gods would take notice and move to thwart his plans. In the 2nd edition module "A Paladin in Hell" Azmodeus attempts to become a god because given his own level of power if godhood were added to his profile he'd be almost unbeatable by the good gods. I've kind of rambled away from the primary issue but I prefer to let the fiends grant spells. They represent a primal inhuman evil while the evil gods represent various facets of human evil.