DriveThruRPG Exclusivity
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Phineas Crow
First Post
I doubt that drivethrurpg.com will be around a year from now.
First off, the pricing is ridiculous. An entire level of the distribution system is gone. It's now vendor->retailer->consumer, cutting out the distribution channel. That should eliminate about 30% of the cover price. The second thing that needs to be factored into PDF pricing is print production costs; not the cost of 1 unit when the publisher prints 1,000+ at a time, but the cost for the consumer to print the book out and store it in an organized fashion (be it a binder or taking it to kino's for output). At the very least, that's another $4 knocked off the price. Given the ridiculous prices, entities involved on the vendor or retailer tiers are being greedy. The existence of some low cost PDFs on the site suggest that it is the vendors.
Second, it looks like no one bothered explaining to the vendors exactly how easy it is to break the DRM of PDF files. Adobe has been pushing their DRM crap for more than 5 years now. If it worked, it would be commonplace by now. But to give you an idea how easy it is, for me, it is a simple process involving 5 clicks of the mouse, nothing more. If any DriveThruRPG vendor wants more details, they can email me and ask.
Third, consumers don't like DRM. They're restricted in copy'n'paste (10 times in 10 days) and I've heard some complaints about printing issues (DRM interferes with PS output to printers using Adobe's own drivers). Consumers can't keep a copy at home on the desktop they use for internet services and their laptops, because each time you open the file on the other computer, you have to get permission to read it. You upgrade your memory, add a new hard drive, change the processor, and you need to get permissions again. How many times do you think a consumer will tolerate that overly intrusive nonsense before they abandon a game system anyway?
I hope vendors are paying attention to the VAST negative feedback that has developed in the last 48 hours. There are literally hundreds of negative posts on the subject on rpg.net. I have no doubt that we'll see a drastic rise in the number of posts in coming weeks.
First off, the pricing is ridiculous. An entire level of the distribution system is gone. It's now vendor->retailer->consumer, cutting out the distribution channel. That should eliminate about 30% of the cover price. The second thing that needs to be factored into PDF pricing is print production costs; not the cost of 1 unit when the publisher prints 1,000+ at a time, but the cost for the consumer to print the book out and store it in an organized fashion (be it a binder or taking it to kino's for output). At the very least, that's another $4 knocked off the price. Given the ridiculous prices, entities involved on the vendor or retailer tiers are being greedy. The existence of some low cost PDFs on the site suggest that it is the vendors.
Second, it looks like no one bothered explaining to the vendors exactly how easy it is to break the DRM of PDF files. Adobe has been pushing their DRM crap for more than 5 years now. If it worked, it would be commonplace by now. But to give you an idea how easy it is, for me, it is a simple process involving 5 clicks of the mouse, nothing more. If any DriveThruRPG vendor wants more details, they can email me and ask.
Third, consumers don't like DRM. They're restricted in copy'n'paste (10 times in 10 days) and I've heard some complaints about printing issues (DRM interferes with PS output to printers using Adobe's own drivers). Consumers can't keep a copy at home on the desktop they use for internet services and their laptops, because each time you open the file on the other computer, you have to get permission to read it. You upgrade your memory, add a new hard drive, change the processor, and you need to get permissions again. How many times do you think a consumer will tolerate that overly intrusive nonsense before they abandon a game system anyway?
I hope vendors are paying attention to the VAST negative feedback that has developed in the last 48 hours. There are literally hundreds of negative posts on the subject on rpg.net. I have no doubt that we'll see a drastic rise in the number of posts in coming weeks.
marketingman
Explorer
I guess it is always the way of "exclusive" to work there way into the PDF format. But if the gaming print side of this is a guage it will notbe as successful has they heve hoped.
Like Black Dragon Press exclusive with Alliance, Stellar Games exclusive with Hobby Games US, DC comics Exclusive with Hero Games.
The nice thing is that RPGNow has another company trying to emulate them, that is a sign of success for them. Some else believes what they started is worthwhile and possible profitable.
Like Black Dragon Press exclusive with Alliance, Stellar Games exclusive with Hobby Games US, DC comics Exclusive with Hero Games.
The nice thing is that RPGNow has another company trying to emulate them, that is a sign of success for them. Some else believes what they started is worthwhile and possible profitable.
Darrin Drader
Explorer
I have no opinion on this subject, just an observation. I've tried twice in two days to go to the DrviethruRPG website and twice it has failed to come up. If I were a publisher of RPG material, I doubt that would inspire my confidence.
jmucchiello
Hero
I have to agree. As a consumer I wrote off DTRPG when after 10 minutes "loading" it still hadn't come up. As a publisher I want nothing to do with DRM. I think it's bad for both me and my customers.Whisperfoot said:
BryonD
Hero
Does anyone know exactly what DRM restrictions will be in place?
Can I back up my stuff?
Can I print my stuff?
If my hard drive goes Tango Uniform will I be out of the files and out of luck.
As usual, I am perfectly happy with whatever someone else wants to do with their business. But there is more good stuff out there than I choose to budget for gaming already. So if you put one strike against yourself, you are out as far as I am concerned.
Can I back up my stuff?
Can I print my stuff?
If my hard drive goes Tango Uniform will I be out of the files and out of luck.
As usual, I am perfectly happy with whatever someone else wants to do with their business. But there is more good stuff out there than I choose to budget for gaming already. So if you put one strike against yourself, you are out as far as I am concerned.
Old Fezziwig
Thanks for the sour persimmons, cousin.
It came up for me, after a good long while. Between that, the prices, and the whole DRM thing, there's no way I'll use DriveThruRPG. It's too much of a pain in the neck for me, as I buy .pdf products mostly for (1) ease of use and (2) for pricing (I'll pay low prices for something interesting that I don't anticipate using much but would like to read). This basically makes the whole deal a royal pain, AFAIC.
Best,
Nick
Best,
Nick
HellHound
ENnies winner and NOT Scrappy Doo
Dana, I can't believe I'm asking this 
... email me. (I can't find an email link for you anywhere that works anymore). mjasonparent@ambient.ca
... email me. (I can't find an email link for you anywhere that works anymore). mjasonparent@ambient.caI'm not a publisher, I am consumer...wanted to get that right out in the clear.
I have purchased several eBooks--and it was *horrible*. Copying files from PC to another (specificially home and work) was a pain in the *bleep*. And requiring a MS Passport? Has any even bothered to read what restrictions having a MSPassport means?
Needless to say I will never purchase a product that uses DRM again. If these publishers plan to release their products using DRM, they will lose my dollars. Insignicant at first pass, but once other consumers buy these products and learn what a hassle--not mention a restriction of fair use--DRM is, I imagine that these companies will lose their dollars as well.
I can understand wanting to restrict piracy, but all DRM does is restrict the ability of someone who has legally purchased the product to easily use and transport the material.
I have purchased several eBooks--and it was *horrible*. Copying files from PC to another (specificially home and work) was a pain in the *bleep*. And requiring a MS Passport? Has any even bothered to read what restrictions having a MSPassport means?
Needless to say I will never purchase a product that uses DRM again. If these publishers plan to release their products using DRM, they will lose my dollars. Insignicant at first pass, but once other consumers buy these products and learn what a hassle--not mention a restriction of fair use--DRM is, I imagine that these companies will lose their dollars as well.
I can understand wanting to restrict piracy, but all DRM does is restrict the ability of someone who has legally purchased the product to easily use and transport the material.
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