[Dungeon] Adventure Path setting?

[Samnell]

I picked up an issue of Dungeon for the first time in some while to mine for my PBEMs. I had been toying with looking into the Adventure Path, and this seemed as good a time as any. I have a few cities around that I'd like to involve the PCs with and I was hoping I could take Cauldron and swap it out for one of those cities.

I open the magazine and see Cauldron's set in the mouth of a volcano. Well if that doesn't complicate things. I haven't read the adventure text yet, but I thought I'd ask and possibly save myself some reading. How necessary is Cauldron as a setting for Life's Bazaar? Is the adventure itself generic enough that any large town would do?

 

[Spatula]

Any town that has the possibility of large caverns underneath would be suitable. I can't say if the future adventures might not require some specific feature of Cauldron, though. The next one, I think, has something to do with the lake at the town's center.

 

[wolff96]

The adventure itself can be really tough for the listed party levels.
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I'm currently running it for a group of five PCs, who are at or just above the recommended levels.

The really nasty encounters are the Grell -- which can take the -20 to grapple checks and still win every one of them -- and the mimic. Why anyone would put a mimic (which are very tough even at even CR) in an adventure where it can absolutely dismantle low-level PCs is beyond me.

Also, if the party fights the Animated Chain, BEWARE. It is incredibly powerful against the low-level (mine were 3 at that point) PCs.

Minor story issues: Think about the Last Laugh. That's one plot point my players instantly glommed onto. Patch is listed as an informer, but there is absolutely no reason in the module for the PCs to suspect him. The secret doors are very hard to find for 1st level PCs. The Vanishing is pretty brutal if the PCs are made with point-buy and have CHA for a dump stat. (I was lucky... the Sorcerer was the only one to catch it so far -- and coincedentally, the only one with a CHA above base.) Finally, the gear doors are BRUTAL until the PCs realize they need keys or to avoid the gears and find a way around them. Finally, the search DCs to find the gems in the middle of the Pulverizers (and other goodies in there in some cases) are very high -- 24. That requires a maxed search check and a very, VERY good roll for such low-level PCs.

Funny Story: My PCs killed the hobgoblins and made their way down the elevator. Then they went to camp at the bottom of the shaft. They were found by the hobgoblins that were going to relieve the ones guarding the top of the shaft. So the party flees back up the shaft just ahead of the hobgoblin reinforcements. I decide -- on the fly -- to have a hob jam the elevator by sticking his sword into the chains. The elevator slams to a halt, nearly dumping the PCs... especially the one in plate, who is saved only by the rogue grabbing him.

Then the hobs grab the half-dwarf and he sends the Animated Chain up after them (it has a listed climb speed, so it made sense to me.) The battle between the PCs and the Animated Chain on a tilted platform half-way up an enormous elevator shaft is probably the best fight I have *EVER* come up with. It was a blast.

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Despite having a few questionable monsters -- IMO -- this is a GREAT adventure. I highly recommend it.

 

[HellHound]

I have NO PROBLEM running it in another city as it stands.

Although the fact that the city in question for my game is in Arcanis has changed a few things (changed almost all the gnome references to dwarves).

If anything, it allowed me to add another few layers to my city... a beholder who controls the mayor, and a new guild of thieves for my players to have as rivals (since we are running an all-rogue game, the party are all members of a thieve's guild, which was the first adventure they played).

 

[Thomasson]

The adventure itself can be really tough for the listed party levels.
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SPOILER WARNING










The really nasty encounters are the Grell -- which can take the -20 to grapple checks and still win every one of them -- and the mimic. Why anyone would put a mimic (which are very tough even at even CR) in an adventure where it can absolutely dismantle low-level PCs is beyond me.

Also, if the party fights the Animated Chain, BEWARE. It is incredibly powerful against the low-level (mine were 3 at that point) PCs.

Minor story issues: Think about the Last Laugh. That's one plot point my players instantly glommed onto. Patch is listed as an informer, but there is absolutely no reason in the module for the PCs to suspect him. The secret doors are very hard to find for 1st level PCs. The Vanishing is pretty brutal if the PCs are made with point-buy and have CHA for a dump stat. (I was lucky... the Sorcerer was the only one to catch it so far -- and coincedentally, the only one with a CHA above base.) Finally, the gear doors are BRUTAL until the PCs realize they need keys or to avoid the gears and find a way around them. Finally, the search DCs to find the gems in the middle of the Pulverizers (and other goodies in there in some cases) are very high -- 24. That requires a maxed search check and a very, VERY good roll for such low-level PCs.

Funny Story: My PCs killed the hobgoblins and made their way down the elevator. Then they went to camp at the bottom of the shaft. They were found by the hobgoblins that were going to relieve the ones guarding the top of the shaft. So the party flees back up the shaft just ahead of the hobgoblin reinforcements. I decide -- on the fly -- to have a hob jam the elevator by sticking his sword into the chains. The elevator slams to a halt, nearly dumping the PCs... especially the one in plate, who is saved only by the rogue grabbing him.

Then the hobs grab the half-dwarf and he sends the Animated Chain up after them (it has a listed climb speed, so it made sense to me.) The battle between the PCs and the Animated Chain on a tilted platform half-way up an enormous elevator shaft is probably the best fight I have *EVER* come up with. It was a blast.

------------------------------------

Despite having a few questionable monsters -- IMO -- this is a GREAT adventure. I highly recommend it.

Chris Perkins likes to err on the side of more challenging encounters. I can speak on this with authority, having played in his Arveniar campaign for a year now. Boy howdy, does he try to kick our butts! I think he does a great job including some encounters that severely challenge the PCs' tactics and abilities with encounters that merely challenge. It keeps them on their toes.

The mimic doesn't have to be a combat encounter. If the PCs are gung-ho for combat, they are likely to get stuck (ahem) with a nasty fight here. But that's not necessarily a guarantee.

I run this campaign as an internal, ongoing playtest. When my characters ran into Patch, they asked him the same series of questions they were asking of each of the orphanage employees. When they got to, "Do you know anything about Terrem?" I had him take 10 on a Bluff check when he answered, and one of the PCs immediately picked up on it. The Vanishing is tough, and the two of my characters contracted it from the bag of tricks. I had them consult a local sage I made up on the spot (after some Gather Information checks and a couple tense days of Charisma loss) and pay a couple hundred gold to figure out a dispel magic would take care of it. As for the gear doors, I was incredibly disappointed when my characters learned quickly that the creeper/stalker tunnels circumvented most of them. When they found the first key, the party gnome immediately made the connection, and I didn't get to spring a single trap on them. Secret doors and other important goodies were found by the group taking a lot of 20s on Search checks.

My group might sound like a bunch of pros, but they had their share of goofs. They triggered the trap on the stairs into Jzadirune even after they found it. They blundered through the encounters with Keygan Ghelve, stalking him, confronting him (but never actually asking about the kidnappings, even though they suspected him), and finally attacking him. See my editorial in issue #98 for an update on the final encounter, which was basically a disaster.

Oh, and that encounter with the chain sounds fantastic!

 

[Iron_Chef]

When is the next Dungeon coming out? When is it going monthly? Will the page count remain the same?

 

[Spatula]

SPOILER WARNING
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The secret doors are very hard to find for 1st level PCs.

They're all DC 20 aren't they? Barely even secret. Anyone with an average INT and no ranks in Search can find them just by taking 20 in the right spot. And in any case, none of the secret doors lead anywhere that is plot-critical. IIRC, they all lead to extra encounters and/or goodies, or sometimes provide easier access to certain areas.

 

[Samnell]

I just finished reading the adventure. I thought up a place for Cauldron in my world, so the setting is no longer an issue.

This thing really is a nice piece of work. I especially like the last encounter, which seems just guaranteed to cause players to lose control of bodily functions after attempts at disbelief fail.

 

[Thomasson]

When is the next Dungeon coming out? When is it going monthly? Will the page count remain the same?

Issue #98 should be heading to subscribers as I speak. Our first monthly issue, issue #98 has 60 pages of Dungeon content and 40 pages of Polyhedron content. The Dungeon half features "Flood Season," the second Adventure Path installment, "Gluttony," and "Wings, Spikes, and Teeth." We're about to hand issue #99 off, but I've been spending a lot of time working on issue #100. Our centennial issue is something else, but I'll have more to say about that in a few weeks. Let's just say that my author list for issue #100 includes some names you'll be sure to recognize.

 

[wolff96]

The mimic doesn't have to be a combat encounter. If the PCs are gung-ho for combat, they are likely to get stuck (ahem) with a nasty fight here. But that's not necessarily a guarantee.

The first mimic they negotiated with. The second one -- the one guarding the half-dwarf's treasure -- is listed as being unwilling to make a deal and will not negotiate at all.

They attacked it. Scratch one PC. (Though they did win.)

They also lost a PC to the Grell. Even with the -20 to it's grapple check, none of them could break free.

When they found the first key, the party gnome immediately made the connection, and I didn't get to spring a single trap on them. Secret doors and other important goodies were found by the group taking a lot of 20s on Search checks.

My group didn't want to take 20 on every single five foot square of wall throughout the entire complex. The part in the divination about "...half a dwarf binds them, but not for long" was something they took VERY literally. So they found two or three secret doors out of the entire complex.

And the rogue was quite determined to unlock at least ONE of those gear doors -- until he nearly died in the process. Then they just avoided them all.

By the way -- the fighter used a copper coin on the Magic Mouth and got cursed. Minus six to his Dex. Then they ran into the giant spider in the illusionary fountain and he failed both of his fortitude saves and lost an additional six Strength. Talk about unlucky!

Oh, and that encounter with the chain sounds fantastic!

It was wonderful and a great deal of fun. Especially as I'm describing the sounds of chain rattling over chain as the creature came up the load-bearing chains and eventually came into view. (One of the players told me later he thought it might be a Kyton and nearly soiled himself.)

And then, after a VERY difficult fight (made notable by the fighter losing his halberd down the elevator shaft), nearly all of the party FAILED their balance checks as the load on the elevator shifted at the end of the fight. Thankfully, they made the reflex saves I gave them to avoid the long fall...

I nearly TPK'd the party AFTER the fight. You've never seen so many natural 1's in your life!