D&D (2024) Dungeons and Dragons future? Ray Winninger gives a nod to Mike Shea's proposed changes.

[GMforPowergamers]

The Champions abilities have a HP to Spell Slot value. Each Slot has a HP damage or healing value, which can be replicated by Extra Attacks and hit chance.

except that math doesn't hold the moment you have spells that break HP damage expectations, or ones that shut down encounters (effectively doing infante damage)... if every SoS or SoD was based on sleep or the power words I could see this... but they aren't and you get your first SoS/SoD at level 1 spells

 

[Charlaquin]

OK, I'm not saying it's "hard" to read: I'm saying it is boring to read. Dull, uninteresting. I read books from every other Edition for fun, because I enjoy the process of seeking ideas. 4E books were a chore that I would have to do.

Which is pure opinion. You’re trying to dress your personal preferences up as objective facts by misusing terms like “readable” instead of just admitting you didn’t like the writing style.

 

[Parmandur]

we have been told that the rules say that it is something else (where I agree with you and can't argue against you here so go check the perception thread for the argument)

Ha, I'll pass.

 

[Parmandur]

Which is pure opinion. You’re trying to dress your personal preferences up as objective facts by misusing terms like “readable” instead of just admitting you didn’t like the writing style.

Not just my opinion, the D&D team identified the style as one of the major problems.

But yeah, I didn't like the writing style.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Only on par if they spend their resources on keeping up.

but not ALL of there resources... just some... becuse again you can be a blade singer a sword bard or a hex blade get 2nd attack and NOT give up a single spell slot

heck if you want range eldritch blast with 1 invocation (1/2 of what you get at level 2) can keep up with the fighter for all 19 levels left of the game... without useing a spell slot (you get those back on short rest) without taking a subclass, without useing your arcana's that give you a 6th 7th 8th and 9th level spell once per day at the 2nd half of the game...

 

[darjr]

The central issue to me is people play D&D in a lot of different ways. 4e and it’s precise and hyper focus threw that consideration away.

5e embraced it. So for every time someone says “this is ambiguous” I consider it might well be so to enable many play styles. This time, in this edition, largely on purpose. Same with all the natural language in 5e.

4e style of design shines in 5e because of that. IMHO that kind of design in 5e exists in this web of styles and people can approach those designed artifacts in a more flexible way.

 

[Scribe]

what point on the graph is that? (and I don't mean this to be 'lets fight over this' I mean this to be 'if there is a level or way to balance this game I would love to know it')

Note: I don't think it's balanced to my satisfaction.

I believe it's possible to get within spitting distance, of something the designers aimed for though.

They had something of a target. I've been busy though and haven't went and verified the spell slot theory on my own.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

but I just wonder what 4e couldn't do.

I don't know, maybe nothing, if I'd had someone to show me how.

Create a tiefling that didn't have stupid bull horns perhaps?

 

[Dausuul]

Actually it’s intentional imbalance. Fireball is one of a number of spells that was designed to be ahead of the curve, because it’s a fun and iconic spell. I remember a recording of a D&DNext Q&A at some con or other where Mike Mearls talked about this; he said that they wanted “fun spells” like fireball to be more efficient than other options, so that when the character optimization guy with his abacus crunches the numbers, he’ll say “yes, fireball is the best spell!”

Yes, I know. (I don't agree with his reasoning, but I acknowledge that it was a deliberate choice.) However:

1) The imbalance being deliberate does not make it any less of an imbalance.
2) Vampiric touch is not only weak compared to fireball, it's weak compared to virtually any other spell of its level. You do more damage with a cantrip, and the cantrips in question can be used at range.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I don't know, maybe nothing, if I'd had someone to show me how.

yeah we ran high and low magic... we even with ever so slight fluff tweeks ran a modern harry dresden game, but (and I have said this many times) I think the ideas in 4e are ideas I have been useing since 95... things that the system fights against and I have been doing inspite of the system not for it... so maybe there is some style I don't know of that can't be done

Create a tiefling that didn't have stupid bull horns perhaps?

oh yes... just like WotC keeps saying teiflings are all red (even if teh 1st pictured is more purple) but I see lots of people say they play blue green red or black ones all the time (I myself have seen at least half a dozen blue, 1 purple and 1 green... but only 3 red)