Epic Combat Expertise...WTF?

[Hypersmurf]

Really? Where did I get the idea that it added to your EAB then?

To be fair, I'm quoting from the SRD Epic Levels section - I couldn't guarantee the printed ELH or perhaps ELH errata doesn't differ.

-Hyp.

 

[Legildur]

Try combining All Improved Expertise All The Time and All Power Attack All The Time for the best/worst of both worlds.

Okay, this takes me back to an older thread, which I'm sure Hypersmurf contributed to, where there was some discussion about the interaction of Combat Expertise and Power Attack.

One of the points of view put across was that a character with a minimum BAB+5 could take the -5 penalty to attacks and gain the benefits of both Cbt Expertise (+5 to AC) and Power Attack (+5 or +10 damage). Others thought you would need to take a -10 penalty to attack rolls to gain those benefits.

I see it as the latter (because the penalty is from two sources and therefore stacks), but would be interested to see confirmation of that.

 

[Hypersmurf]

One of the points of view put across was that a character with a minimum BAB+5 could take the -5 penalty to attacks and gain the benefits of both Cbt Expertise (+5 to AC) and Power Attack (+5 or +10 damage).

[frown] I can't see any support for that. Each feat requires you to take a penalty. They're not worded as "If you are taking a penalty, you gain X bonus"; the feat allows you to take a penalty, and so each feat must be activated separately by taking a separate penalty.

-Hyp.

 

[glass]

To be fair, I'm quoting from the SRD Epic Levels section - I couldn't guarantee the printed ELH or perhaps ELH errata doesn't differ.

Damn, I meant to check my ELH last night, but I forgot. Hopefully I'll remember tonight.


glass.

 

[glass]

[frown] I can't see any support for that. Each feat requires you to take a penalty. They're not worded as "If you are taking a penalty, you gain X bonus"; the feat allows you to take a penalty, and so each feat must be activated separately by taking a separate penalty.

Quite, you don't get extra PA damage for taking a penalty for expertise, any more than you get extra PA damage for attacking while prone.


glass.

 

[Legildur]

Well, I'm glad my recollections are confirmed. Thanks Hyp/Glass.

 

[glass]

To be fair, I'm quoting from the SRD Epic Levels section - I couldn't guarantee the printed ELH or perhaps ELH errata doesn't differ.

Damn, I meant to check my ELH last night, but I forgot. Hopefully I'll remember tonight.

Checked my ELH last night, and the wording is just the same as you quoted. So I entirely made up the adds to PA (etc) rule. Wierd!


glass.

 

[Votan]

Improved Combat Expertise would synergize well with Wraithstrike. You might not need the BAB and it would do wonderful things to your AC!

 

[Elephant]

I'll thank you to stop talking about my fellow party members like that.

This post made my day.

 

[Kunimatyu]

So, just so I got that, you can disarm a Combat Expertising character really easily? Disarm doesn't require you to hit their touch AC, just to avoid their AoO(which will probably miss if they're expertising) and then win the opposed attack roll, which will be really easy if they're taking a large penalty on attacks from Combat Expertise?

Because if so, that's totally going in my rat-bastardly DM tricks lineup, right along with unarmed disarm versus bows. (take their bow without an AoO and with no net penalty)