Ever had that one player who's just on a different wavelength?

[Tar Markvar]

Well, I admit to railroading. I get very nervous when I'm improvising a story for anything other than the deeply-homebrewed parody version of Champions/Aberrant I ran a couple years ago. A fateful session of Sorcerer turned ugly when I overestimated my abilities to improvise a non-comedy situation, and since then, I've been a bit gunshy.

To be honest, I don't have a lot of wiggle room in GMing style. One player just wants to kill, that much is obvious. One player claims to want story and interaction, but when it happens he dismisses it as flavor text and asks if things could move along. Personally, I love playing a character, or many characters as a GM, but the delicate balance between enough description/dialogue and too much description/dialogue is tricky when you're balancing between a railroading summary and being denounced as flavor text.

I wasn't prepared for the problem, and that's my fault. I told this guy what level the captain was, and that's my fault, too. I did play out the scene of them "negotiating" with the captain, and I RPed the dwarven resistance people they wanted to contact to make further deals. My crime was not being open-minded enough, I suppose.

But GMing with this guy around makes me nervous. If he's having fun (generally when we're hacking dungeons, counter to his mocking tone whenever he talks about hacking dungeons), it's good for everyone. When he's not having fun, he taunts, metagames, and tunes out completely. The game is as shallow as it is because it's hard to go beyond "the magic sword gives you plusses", since anything more than that is mocked as flowery prose. When he GMs, he's very tight against the very things he does to others when he plays their games. And when he plays something like Vampire, his character is usually so min/maxed that he's capable of overpowering everyone and making it into his group.

It seems more and more that the answer is to simply stop GMing D&D for a while, but I enjoy running the game for everyone else, and everyone but him seems to enjoy playing it. I can't very well kick him out, since we're at his house. It's sticky.

Meanwhile, I'll work on being a better GM for non-linear situations. Or keep running modules.

 

[Lela]

As for the player who has trouble keeping OC knowlage OC, I had that same problem on Saterday. I had to come up with an encounter on the fly and flipped through the MM, landing on Manticore.
I described the situation and one of the players asked, "What does it look like." I get a weird feeling but respond, "Well, it has a long tail ending in huge spikes, looks like a flying leapord, and has spikes up and down it's spine."

What does he say? "That's a mantacore." When someone asks if he's sure he loudly exclaims, "No, I'm right. I've read the MM front to back!"

This was especally annoying as the entire group had just been trying to guess what I'd come out with. Each looking at the book and trying to guess what letter I was on. This probally encouraged him.

After I gave him a withering look and mentioned that his character didn't know any of that, he looked a little abashed.

So, for next session, I've gone to the Creature Collection and pulled out a bunch of monsters I could use. I know he's never been there and it should go better.

Another option is to make quick adjustments to monsters, as sudjested by Monte Cook. (His example) Change the Winter Wolf's breath weapon to pure spikes shooting out of it's mouth, up the # of HD by 1, and, last but not least, up the CR by one (also remove any cold subtype it might have--cant remember). It now looks just like a Dire Wolf (no frost hints of any kind) and will freak out players who think they know everything in the MM. All you do is write the changes on a sticky note and pop it on the page.
You can do this with vurtually any monster, helping you create an entire MM within the existing one.

 

[Tar Markvar]

Well, in this case, it was a dwarf NPC. This guy ran the game for a couple sessions a few weeks ago, and for his own information I told him that the captain was a Fighter 7/Pilot 3. When they found themselves aboard the ship, they were all level 5 Kalamar characters; by the time the dwarf decided to leave them they were all level 10 and experienced with Dragonstar armor and weapons (which should add at least +1 CL to anyone using them against normal D&D foes). Whereas in the beginning he was a dangerous foe, now he's a pissant, and this guy knew this. So obviously, killing him would be pretty easy, and so why not just kill him and take the ship?

 

[Pielorinho]

I'm definitely all for changing monster descriptions: it's a rare critter IMC that looks like the MM describes it as looking. And when I'm a player, my favorite fights are often against critters that I can't recognize: they're much scarier for the note of uncertainty in them.

This player, Tar, is sounding more and more like a yahoo. Can you give him a call sometime and talk with him privately? Tell him that you know he's frustrated with the game, and invite him to vent at you. Force him to be specific: ask for examples of things he didn't like. Force him to be positive: ask him to suggest ways you could have run those scenes that he would have enjoyed more. Repeat back to him what you've heard him say. If he describes things you don't think you could do, tell him so, but be very polite about it.

Once you think you've resolved his concerns, tell him that it really bothers you when he tunes out in the middle of a session, that you'd MUCH rather him talk with you privately afterwards if he's got a problem with the game. Give him some ideas on how he can direct the game in directions he'd like to go, acting in-character. Don't threaten to kick him out; don't call him a yahoo. Just work with him, and make it clear that you want to be his partner, not his adversary, in solving the campaign's problems and in making the game a lot of fun.

That's my advice; good luck!
Daniel

 

[Tom Cashel]

I described the situation and one of the players asked, "What does it look like." I get a weird feeling but respond, "Well, it has a long tail ending in huge spikes, looks like a flying leapord, and has spikes up and down it's spine."

What does he say? "That's a mantacore." When someone asks if he's sure he loudly exclaims, "No, I'm right. I've read the MM front to back!"

A variant: that would be the point to substitute all the powers and stats of, say, a full-grown remorhaz or adult blue dragon. The PCs will definitely be surprised when the manticore starts melting all their weapons, or snatching them off the ground and breathing lightning.

Probably stop them from running off at the mouth about how much of the MM they've memorized...

 

[Lela]

Well, in this case, it was a dwarf NPC. This guy ran the game for a couple sessions a few weeks ago, and for his own information I told him that the captain was a Fighter 7/Pilot 3. When they found themselves aboard the ship, they were all level 5 Kalamar characters; by the time the dwarf decided to leave them they were all level 10 and experienced with Dragonstar armor and weapons (which should add at least +1 CL to anyone using them against normal D&D foes). Whereas in the beginning he was a dangerous foe, now he's a pissant, and this guy knew this. So obviously, killing him would be pretty easy, and so why not just kill him and take the ship?

Shouldn't he have leveled up during that time as well? And you never mentioned what the rest of the crew was like. For all he knew, much of the crew was up-to-par with the captain. Also, what's to stop him from having a few other NPCs-who happen to be in charge of secerity--be 12th or 13th level? This ship has to be prepared to defend against ANYTHING it might run accross out in the planes--a place where, IMC, demons and devils abound.

 

[Lela]

A variant: that would be the point to substitute all the powers and stats of, say, a full-grown remorhaz or adult blue dragon. The PCs will definitely be surprised when the manticore starts melting all their weapons, or snatching them off the ground and breathing lightning.

Probably stop them from running off at the mouth about how much of the MM they've memorized...

I did need a plan three. That'll do. I should also carry around the Zombie templete, at which point I could just add it to any monster I need to.

Maybe a rider, one with the spirited charge and mounted combat feat chain.

 

[Andor]

Well, I admit to railroading. I get very nervous when I'm improvising a story for anything other than the deeply-homebrewed parody version of Champions/Aberrant I ran a couple years ago. A fateful session of Sorcerer turned ugly when I overestimated my abilities to improvise a non-comedy situation, and since then, I've been a bit gunshy.

To be honest, I don't have a lot of wiggle room in GMing style. One player just wants to kill, that much is obvious. One player claims to want story and interaction, but when it happens he dismisses it as flavor text and asks if things could move along.

Well to speak in the players defense, if there is a fixed outcome to any negotiation determined before you go into it, then it is just flavor text. I love to roleplay, but if there is no way on god's green earth that I can effect the the outcome of a situation then I'm not roleplaying, I'm listening to the GM's radio talk show.

-Andor

 

[zyzzyr]

Ideas for ForceUser

ForceUser,

I take it from your first post that she is a rogue. If what I say offends anyone, please feel free to slap me around.

I find that women RPGers (as you described - interested in frilly things, candles, puppies, and such) typically enjoy playing either druids or wizards (sometimes rangers). I don't know why, but in all the games I've played in/seen that has yet to be broken. (Note! I am sure that there are women who enjoy all classes! Please do not turn this thread into a male/female debate!)

I have 2 women in my session that are similar to what you describe (in terms of interest).

Here are some ideas that you might want to try to get her more involved in roleplaying:

1) Protection of the defenseless
This falls into the "puppies and babies" category, which a lot of women find hard to resist. Place some helpless individuals (not slaves or anything, something that is loveable) in dire danger. Have the group try to save said loveable creature. If you want, throw in a head "loveable creature", such as the unicorn mage that is slowly dying, and roleplay out those scenarios. Do not try to roleplay mechanics, it doesn't work very well (in my experience).

2) Vicarious Romance
Introduce the group to a suitor who is pining away for his love, which cannot be, for whatever reason (think Romeo and Juliet). The group is to somehow reunite the two lovers, without getting either one killed. Conversely, have an individual wasting away for his lost love, who no longer speaks to him because she is under the false impression that he betrayed her (this works well with kings and princesses, and the princess believes that the king has betrayed her people, thus she never talks to him again). Other options in this category are:
- bringing together the noblewoman and the charismatic thief
- the king and the peasant woman
There are lots of RP opportunities in the romance scenario, as it is mostly trying to convince people.

3) Dragons and high magic
I don't know why, but this always seems to be a hit. Dragons are ultrapowerful, and if you introduce a storyline involving the PCs having to negotiate with dragons (not to save their lives, but instead trying to broker a deal with them, perhaps to defend a kingdom or release a powerful artifact, or negotiate a peace treaty among the dragons), this might get her more involved in RP.

For some reason, I find that they will almost always pick up at least one of these storylines and really enjoy it.

A few notes:
- Minimize mechanic roleplaying in situations that do not involve non-combative player interaction. It doesn't work very well, especially when you come across a situation in which the player, trying to detect traps, says: "I look for pit traps", but rolls well, and the DM says: "You find a latch trap on the lock." It seems odd, since the player wasn't looking there.
- Non-combative PC - NPC interaction are the absolute best to roleplay. If she usually defers to someone else, orchestrate a scenario where the only person the NPC would trust is her PC - maybe another woman, another thief, another of similar race.

Lastly, maybe she doesn't like RP? There are some people (including women) like that...

Anyhow, just trying to help.

zyzzyr

 

[zyzzyr]

Changing monsters

I recently ran a session with a friend who has much more experience than me. However, I have more 3e mechanics experience so I was DMing. Anyhoo...

We have a nighttime encounter involving wights - or what look like wights. I added a new ability to the wights (now called superwights) - Leap (Ex): A superwight can leap up to 100 feet as a standard action.

Well, I had to be a little meaner than that, though. When he asked what they look like, I told him they were husks of men - hunched over, claws for fingers, stretched skin, fangs and wild hair. He looked at me quizzically. So I told him "They look like wights, though of course your characters don't know what wights are. Just to give you an idea."

Wights go first. They are 80 feet away. They leap 100 feet and land in the middle of the party, surrounding the cleric.

His response? "Wights can't do that!!" I think more out of surprise than metagaming.

That was just perfect.