Fiend Folio: what wasn't included

[Pants]

That was less a "supposed to be" than an out-and-out error. It should have been "Brain Golem". Sadly, that error is still repeated elsewhere, but hopefully will be changed soon. *elbows BOZ*

Damn.
I liked the old Bone Golem. Oh well, that explains things.
Thanks.

 

[BOZ]

 

[Voadam]

I believe there is a skeleton golem in Denizens of Darkness, the Ravenloft 3e creature book.

There is a fallen outsider template in Minions: Rebirth by Bastion Press.

 

[BOZ]

That was less a "supposed to be" than an out-and-out error. It should have been "Brain Golem". Sadly, that error is still repeated elsewhere, but hopefully will be changed soon. *elbows BOZ*

Is that better? is it finally complete now?

 

[Gez]

There is a fallen outsider template in Minions: Rebirth by Bastion Press.

And a fallen celestial in Legions of Hell, by Green Ronin Publishing.

Otherwise, there's always the possibility to use the Half-Outsider templates as a mechanical base for fallen or redeemed (just wing the rules about how and on what these templates are normally applied). Then, either you remove alignment-based SQ and SA, or you convert them to the other side, depending on whether you want the fallen/redeemed more powerful or not.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Major problem that I have with fallen celestial templates is their tendency to increase the base creature's power. I don't think that a fallen solar necessarily should be any more powerful than one who sticks to the straight and narrow.

Also, a fiend is a perfectly reasonable class of fallen celestial. Judeo-Christian tradition regarding demons separates them into three major classes: Demiurgical creations (apocryphal, but there is the suggestion that there are "demons" running around even before the Word brought forth order from chaos); the Lilim; and the fallen angels of the Rebel Host. So, while all demons don't need to be fallen celestials, fallen celestials certainly make up a large portion of demonkind. It seems fine to me that a balor would be a celestial perverted to the cause of evil.

 

[Grazzt]

Major problem that I have with fallen celestial templates is their tendency to increase the base creature's power. I don't think that a fallen solar necessarily should be any more powerful than one who sticks to the straight and narrow.

It seems fine to me that a balor would be a celestial perverted to the cause of evil.

Yep- that's how I see and play it IMC. Just me perhaps...

 

[Aeris Winterood]

I concur...

A fallen celestial would lose many of its "good" abilities which would balance out with gaining some "evil" ones...so if anything it would or should IMO lose power when "falling" ...

 

[Grazzt]

Re: I concur...

A fallen celestial would lose many of its "good" abilities which would balance out with gaining some "evil" ones...so if anything it would or should IMO lose power when "falling" ...

I dont really think it should lose power, but I dont think it should gain power either. In game terms, simply "flip" its abilities. "Detect evil" becomes "detect good", "dispel evil" becomes "dispel good", etc.

 

[Aeris Winterood]

Divine powers...

Maybe it should lose power to start...

All of its life its divine power was given because of its faith and was infused by the powers over it....Suddenly, for whatever reason it is tempted by evil... falls into disgrace and out of heaven. Its divine holy power is taken from it... The creature then has to find a higher power "evil" who must be able to "trust" it... or to believe in it to start to be able to give it its profane power....

That is my belief, wherein I think angelic hosts come of some of their power from the high-ups..... so then to gain power back after fallen they have to gain favor of some diabolic power....