D&D (2024) Fighter brainstorm

[Pauln6]

why would WOTC write up a subclass that was meant primarily to synergize with a feature that (at the time) was considered totally optional...?

Well, that's true but feats and multi-classing to allow more options to build more nuanced concepts. You have less to work with without them.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

Well, that's true but feats and multi-classing to allow more options to build more nuanced concepts. You have less to work with without them.

i mean. yeah. but if we're going to judge how well a subclass fulfills a concept, i don't think it makes much sense to point at features it clearly wasn't expected to interact with and say "well you can supplement it with these so it's fine".

 

[Garthanos]

I saw someone homebrew second tier manoeuvres that cost two superiority dice and could affect more than one target. It would be easy to do that for warlords too.

Ironically, the banneret is uninspiring and doesn't seem to be a popular choice. If the banneret was given non-scaling d6 superiority dice instead of proficiency in persuasion, giving them the manoeuvres that affects charisma checks and then a choice from the other warlord type manoeuvres, it would take it a step closer to where it needs to be IMO.

In previous editions, fighter-mages were only possible via multi-classing. I always assumed that eldritch knight was just intended to synergise a bit better with that process, not that it was ever intended to reflect the trope on its own.

Yes in some ways Eldritch Knight is a multi-class without multi-classing but why the BM is innadequate as a Warlord and (even a better written) PDK probably would be too... is because a multi-class is not going to reflect the archetype of one of its parent nearly as well as the full thing.

Oh and Eldritch one has another heritage it is not reflecting well but definitely tries to... 4e had a great class in the Swordmage many of its mechanisms were incorporated in the Eldritch Knight but kind of poorly (even the copies of its at-will powers in 5e are lamer versions).

Another strange bit -> The echo knight was cribbed from spamming 1 power from the 4e SM.

 

[Pauln6]

i mean. yeah. but if we're going to judge how well a subclass fulfills a concept, i don't think it makes much sense to point at features it clearly wasn't expected to interact with and say "well you can supplement it with these so it's fine".

True but the flipside is that single class multiclassing has never, nor will it ever satisfy the desire for 1e multiclassing.

Full implementation of the sword mage or warlord was always going to be tricky given that they chose to stick broadly to the classic class silos but I do agree that it was frustrating that the class features barely added a dash of colour.

Wholesale rebranding seems really unlikely though so I think more focus should be placed on nudging the existing subclasses rather than expending energy on changes that are pie in the sky.

 

[Clint_L]

I think fighters are already very powerful in combat. They might be boring, but they are extremely effective at dealing and taking damage. But combat is the least interesting part of the game, for me. I would like to see more attention paid to how they play outside of combat, and giving them more abilities to contribute other than (typically) being the intimidator and muscle.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

You mean like a 'simple' class swinging a sword blandly and repeatedly ad nauseum?

encounter/short rest powers are all the more important

 

[Vaalingrade]

encounter/short rest powers are all the more important

Never underestimate the power of good At-wills. Wolfpack Tactics, baby.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Never underestimate the power of good At-wills. Wolfpack Tactics, baby.

The good mix (andd I no longer think 4e had it right) is best...

look at 2014's warlock, 2 subclasses 2 at wlls at 1st a 3rd at 4th and a 4th at 9th or 10th... aa number of encounter abilities equal to your level, BUT you can only power 2 at a time (like the spells) an a suit of special mini feats that can give you new at wills, new always on or new ways to use those 2 encounter power slots... personally my favs are teh hexblade and the tome, making basic attack another atwill and tome giving you 2 more at wills at level 3

 

[MechaTarrasque]

People often talk about doing the ranger like the warlock, but maybe the fighter is the better choice for it. I don't know if I would call them "martial invocations" (especially since I assume a few of them won't actually be martial), but someone who wants to be a simple champion can just pick the straight forward damage increasing MI"s (plus some that are subclass specific), A different fighter might pick up a weaker version of inspiration, a curse or a blessing like you would expect from warlocks (invocations) or paladins. There might be a martial arts MI, some kind of barroom brawler MI, and even a weaker version of sneak attack.

That way you can get the whole Conan "I picked up a little of this, and a little of that" without having to multiclass, because obviously Conan was swinging his sword 4 times a round.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

People often talk about doing the ranger like the warlock, but maybe the fighter is the better choice for it. I don't know if I would call them "martial invocations" (especially since I assume a few of them won't actually be martial), but someone who wants to be a simple champion can just pick the straight forward damage increasing MI"s (plus some that are subclass specific),

I like the 4e exploits, but I could live with the 3.5/5e maneuvers

A different fighter might pick up a weaker version of inspiration, a curse or a blessing like you would expect from warlocks (invocations) or paladins. There might be a martial arts MI, some kind of barroom brawler MI, and even a weaker version of sneak attack.

Thats the thing... imagine you take the warlock 1 per short rest at 1st 2 at 2nd though 10th... they level at half level. At level one your options are "use a slot to make the next target you hit before the end of this round make a save or be disarmed" then another that trips, another that causes a -1d4 deebuff on saves. then have one that deals +1d10 damage. but have them scale at level 3,5,7,9 like spells do. Have one that allows you to make 2 attacks but they have to be against diffrent targets... but at 3rd level they can be against the same and at 5th you can make 3 attacks but only 2 against one target and at 7th all 3 can go to one target and at 9th you can make 4 attacks but 1 must be against another target...... have one be commander strike. The commander strike and the extra damage one totally scale easily enought... have one that inspires to heal the way healing word for a cleric does.
At level 2 those invocations are super easy... one could give you 2 trained skills in a thematic set (investigation and insight, or insight and perception or athletics and acrobatics) one that grants an off stat attack "use wis instead of str/dex or what ever' one that lets you have unarmed def... one that once per day lets you use a slot to duplicate a cool 1st or 2nd level spell.

That way you can get the whole Conan "I picked up a little of this, and a little of that" without having to multiclass, because obviously Conan was swinging his sword 4 times a round.