D&D (2024) Fighter (Playtest 7)

[Vaalingrade]

no matter, think now how fast would that halfling move a 3lb sword around.

However fast you want because they're a fictional species with capabilities as the plot demands.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Is it really speculation when there's a old school style that doesn't have that problem, a new school skull that does have that problem, and Jeremy Crawford is in his 50s?

1+1+1=3?

When that is literally the closest you have to evidence supporting it? Yes, that is no more than speculation.

And I’ve watched him run games, he literally does use big scary high CR monsters, and seems to dislike the drawn out combat that comes from having 30 combatants as opposed to 10.

 

[Kurotowa]

Battlemaster should have been core fighter feature,

Crawford addresses this in the video. He says they've heard that idea and considered it, but decided against it for two reasons. One is that the Battle Master is popular and they don't want to kill it to give other subclasses a watered down version of what it does. The other is that, believe it or not, not everyone likes Maneuvers and they don't want to force them on players who don't want them.

While I'm all for bringing all the Fighter subclasses up to a good level of performance, I can't entirely say he's wrong that chopping up the Battle Master and giving everyone a small piece is not the way to go. Like, would it really be satisfying to have two Superiority Dice and one Maneuver? I don't think so.

 

[Horwath]

However fast you want because they're a fictional species with capabilities as the plot demands.

if it's not directly explained by a rule or magic, I treat everything as planet Earth physics.

So, no matter the strength, even if it's 20, a 40lb halfling cannot wield 10lb weapon in melee with any sort of competence.

 

[Horwath]

Crawford addresses this in the video. He says they've heard that idea and considered it, but decided against it for two reasons. One is that the Battle Master is popular and they don't want to kill it to give other subclasses a watered down version of what it does. The other is that, believe it or not, not everyone likes Maneuvers and they don't want to force them on players who don't want them.

While I'm all for bringing all the Fighter subclasses up to a good level of performance, I can't entirely say he's wrong that chopping up the Battle Master and giving everyone a small piece is not the way to go. Like, would it really be satisfying to have two Superiority Dice and one Maneuver? I don't think so.

give every fighter number of dice(d6, no scaling) equal to proficiency bonus and number of maneuvers equal to proficiency bonus.
give battlemaster double of that and scaling of dice, d10 at 7th level. d12 at 15th level.

if you want a simple fighter;
Barbarian ------> that way.

 

[Stalker0]

Everyone talking about how amazing the fighter looks makes me think I'm reading a different version from everyone else because I'm just not seeing it?
They still have basically no high level features, Tactical mind just doesn't read that great to me, they removed martial adept but kept the much worse martial expert and moved it to later level, battlemaster still doesn't get new maneuvers at higher levels so it quickly becomes pick the least bad option, know thy enemy is still mostly a ribbon but now only once per day instead of at will (it sure isn't worth spending a superiority dice on).
So what am I missing? why does everyone think it is great?

So here is the list. Lets look at a 10th level battlemaster 2014 vs 2024.

• 4 second winds vs 1
• Weapon Mastery allows them to push, prone, get advantage, attack multiple targets, all before we even consider BM maneuvers. This allows for a number of combos. Take for example, I can topple an opponent prone and knock them back with a BM maneuver. If its a melee creature, that basically shuts down its offense for the next round, as just one quick example.
• Can now move half speed with no OAs when using a second wind, so basically can get a bit of extra speed when needed and can move around tight scenarios.
• Indomitable: At 10th level I get a +10 to my saving throw, so its almost auto-pass (aka legendary resistance 1/day).
• Gets an extra skill through student of war.
• Know your enemy now actually works in combat (as a bonus action) and can give you immediately useful info about the enemy (resistances, vulnerabilities, etc). It does have a limit now though, but that can be extended with superiority dice.
• Various maneuvers have been improved and strengthened. This also includes two manuevers that give fighters additional skill bonuses if they want out of combat power.
• Can now add +1d10 to any failed check by spending a second wind, which gives you a lot of versatility when you have a critical check you just need to pass.

Now does this fighter compete with the high level casters, we can debate that. But its clear that this fighter has had a number of solid buffs compare to its predecessor. Its straight up stronger, has more personal healing, it has more tactical options with weapon mastery, indomitable is now a LOT more powerful, maneuvers are better, etc etc.

 

[Stalker0]

give every fighter number of dice(d6, no scaling) equal to proficiency bonus and number of maneuvers equal to proficiency bonus.
give battlemaster double of that and scaling of dice, d10 at 7th level. d12 at 15th level.

if you want a simple fighter;
Barbarian ------> that way.

Crawford directly addressed this in the last video. In simple terms.....its just not happening. They debated it internally and even tried out some options early on, and it got dropped. There is no world in which the fighter will have maneuvers by default in 2024.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

Battle Master is popular and they don't want to kill it to give other subclasses a watered down version of what it does.

I like how the assumption right away is that it has to be watered down.

 

[Vaalingrade]

ok,
so faster sword is harder to dodge/block and 10lb weapon is so slow it should come with built in -5 attack modifier. or -10 even.

Okay, let's check the 5e weapon speed chart to see how it should work in game.

if it's not directly explained by a rule or magic, I treat everything as planet Earth physics

In the immortal words of Jamie Hyneman: There's your problem. It's not Earth. It's a Fantasy world repleate with living flying tanks, immortal stick men who never sleep, and little dudes who are now allowed to be awesome.

 

[Parmandur]

Now does this fighter compete with the high level casters, we can debate that.

In terms of DPR, 100%. The changes to Second Wind and Tactical Mind alone give the Fighter a gigantic boost outside of combat, too.