D&D 5E Fighters are amazing!

[Pickles JG]

I want to play just a simple fighter, no subclass. I don't want to have to pick from any lists of abilities, just get whatever the fighter gets with level advancement.

Champion does this - once you choose champion you just get the short list of things he gets - other sub classes have to make further choices.

 

[Pickles JG]

Yeah. I suspect that this is a player type thing. Players, especially groups of players, take their gaming habits with them from table to table. And it's probably not an either / or situation. A given DM might allow a trip outside of RAW, but might not allow ducking behind a pillar when it is not your turn in order to get a save versus a Fireball.

I dunno I used to play Feng Shui with the same groups as I played D&D & in that game almost everyone would be stunting like mad while in D&D they were just attacking (in 3.0 days). Some people of course never do anything else in any game.

My Experience is like yours - hardly anyone ever tries to do anything but just attack.

I tried something early in the playtest - swatting a thrown "bomb" back at the thrower & I ended up covered in whatever foul goo was in it after using my action.

The other guy just made some sort of save & got out of the way. I was deemed to have disadvantage for the rest of the session. Needless to say I did not bother trying anything fun again.

An issue is that if something works very well it can become a stock tactic that greatly powers up the player & it stops being cool once you have seen it a dozen times. One party I DM a bit like ramming people with wagons & in the day flaming oil was often used as napalm. If you do not get any value then you will not bother trying.

I feel its good not to be bound by precedent in DMing or have players who self moderate ( I met one once)

 

[aramis erak]

Given Gary's contributions to various expansions and rules in Strategic Review and later Dragon, I am pretty confident that his words in the Forward in the DMG and Introduction are sincere: the books can't cover all the rules, so come up with what you want as long as you aren't breaking the core skeleton of the game. For example, ability checks first appeared in what? The first three issues of Dragon?

Yep. Dragon Issue 1, page 7. Albeit as 1d100 for (attribute plus 1d(4/6/8/10/12) ) or less... with random determination of the ability. The Bulette also appears in issue 1...

Gygax also suggests (in the 1E DMG) changing rules to mess with the rules lawyers, and several other toxic practices. He may be the man who wrote 1E (0E before supplements really looks much more like Areneson badly edited by Gygax) and published 0E... but his advice was all over the freaking map. Some gems, a few really toxic bits, a lot of not good, and a majority of so-so. And then, there's the use of the Caller. I've found it useful only when doing LARGE groups... as in 10+ players. (My peak was 13 players plus a harlequin/assistant-GM.)

I will say that Dangerous Journeys, Cyborg Commando, and Lejendary Adventures all have pretty much the same advice... So it's really Gary's playstyle.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Yep. And I don't know a single player I ever played with who used every single rule in the DMG. Good lord, I can't even imagine...

 

[BigVanVader]

Gygax also suggests (in the 1E DMG) changing rules to mess with the rules lawyers, and several other toxic practices.

That ain't toxic, that's hilarious. And a good way to bust the player's chops, keep him humble. Iron Sheik style.

 

[KarinsDad]

I dunno I used to play Feng Shui with the same groups as I played D&D & in that game almost everyone would be stunting like mad while in D&D they were just attacking (in 3.0 days). Some people of course never do anything else in any game.

My Experience is like yours - hardly anyone ever tries to do anything but just attack.

I tried something early in the playtest - swatting a thrown "bomb" back at the thrower & I ended up covered in whatever foul goo was in it after using my action.

The other guy just made some sort of save & got out of the way. I was deemed to have disadvantage for the rest of the session. Needless to say I did not bother trying anything fun again.

This is one of the main reasons I read the message boards here. When someone tells a story like this, I think "Mental note: Don't be a dxxk and do this to one of your players".

An issue is that if something works very well it can become a stock tactic that greatly powers up the player & it stops being cool once you have seen it a dozen times. One party I DM a bit like ramming people with wagons & in the day flaming oil was often used as napalm. If you do not get any value then you will not bother trying.

This. It's hard to draw the line as a DM, but making sure that it sometimes happens and sometimes doesn't with a die roll helps.

DM: "You rolled a 4? Sorry, the wagon wheel hit a rut and stopped the wagon dead in its tracks. Your action is finished but you still have movement remaining."

I feel its good not to be bound by precedent in DMing or have players who self moderate ( I met one once)

Did you have to look in the mirror to find a self moderating player, or did you actually find one at a table?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Man, this is just affirming to me that more DMs need to take a que from improv and say yes.

 

[Schmoe]

Man, this is just affirming to me that more DMs need to take a que from improv and say yes.

You need to at least buy me dinner first.

 

[Fralex]

Well, say yes within reason, of course. Like everything else.

 

[Uchawi]

I like some of the fighters abilities, but what the class lacks is depth. The champion is the baseline, and it acts like an anchor to hold other subclasses like the battlemaster or eldritch knight back because it would be bad if those subclasses overshadowed the champion to a great degree. But more importantly what I have always wanted for a fighter class, that no edition of D&D has ever presented well, is flexibility of choice that is currently present with spell casters. I want the fighter and other martial classes to be able to learn or gain more maneuvers just like a caster can gain or choose new spells. Once all classes have access to a toolbox of abilities I believe the playing field will be more level. But that is tradition versus trying something new and original argument, and 5E did not take that path.