D&D 5E Fixing the Fighter: The Zouave

[Garthanos]

Note that this rule isn't actually described anywhere else that I'm aware of, in spite of it's own cross referencing.

My experience was it never came up ... certainly had the potential to show a fighter as awesome but in practice not really.

 

[Arnwolf666]

2e I don't have the weirdly vivid recall that I have with 1e. But it did have to be from the specialist's school, FWIW.
The 1e new spell when you get a new spell level...
...actually, all 1e spell acquisition not simply cribbed from spells or spellbooks was... unclear.

Quite a number of things un-naturally aged you in 1e, particularly otherwise desirable/beneficial things, from Haste to Wish, as a limitation on abuse, in theory (and age-reduction magic always carried a risk of unwinding on you), to the point that the standard 1e goldenrod character sheets had separate space for Age, apparent age, and unnatural aging.
And (though I'm sure this varied wildly) once you got into mucking about with strongholds, the campaign's time frame might shift.
Funny thing, though, there were like three different versions thereof. A cursory PH treatment, CPH, and L&L, I think. I preferred CPH and used it extensively for years (from the DM side of the screen), L&L sounded pretty broken.

Personally I miss aging attacks. I can see why some don’t like energy drain because it was kind of meta. But aging was a legitimate attack from various fairy tales and myths.

 

[Garthanos]

The normal multi-attack of the 1e fighter was also very much unimpressive. (I hear it got better with weapon specialization rules which were tacked on later).

 

[Arnwolf666]

Most 1E monsters didn’t have the hp that 2E monsters had. And 2E monsters generally had more magic resistance than 1E monsters as you raised levels. So with weapon specialization in 2E giving fighters some more damage and magic resistance lowering the wizards it really balanced it out in my opinion. The best wizards in 2E were buffers imho. Getting past those low saves (low saves were good in ad&d) and high magic resistance was difficult.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Funny thing, though, there were like three different versions thereof. A cursory PH treatment, CPH, and L&L, I think. I preferred CPH and used it extensively for years (from the DM side of the screen), L&L sounded pretty broken.

I think we're talking about the SPs in the FR-specific books - Forgotten Realms Adventures (a book that changed my life), Faiths & Avatars, Powers & Pantheons, and Demihuman Deities (very late - 1998, but we sure as naughty word played the naughty word out of the stuff in it). Those were where D&D really "got" what a priest/cleric in the D&D universe should/could be.

Also some were broken AF but such is life.

CPH almost got it, but it suffered from the early Complete book syndrome of feeling like all the material in the book had provide objectively mechanically inferior options to the PHB. It was really weird. They got over it by Complete Bard.

 

[Tony Vargas]

I think we're talking about the SPs in the FR-specific books - Forgotten Realms Adventures (a book that changed my life), Faiths & Avatars, Powers & Pantheons, and Demihuman Deities (very late - 1998, but we sure as naughty word played the naughty word out of the stuff in it).

Well, that'd be a fourth take, then!

Also some were broken AF but such is life.

C'est La D&D. The CPH priesthood creation, c1990, by Aaron Alston, who had worked on Champions! rather a lot, was surprisingly solid, better-balanced than could usually be expected from D&D of the era, and DM-facing, I used it not just for the PCs' priesthoods but for many of the allies & enemies - the gods got pretty involved, late-game, the priests of philosophies were pretty intriguing, I had a number of those placed, too.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Well, that'd be a fourth take, then!

Arguably 4th and 5th, because whilst the later three books were clearly deeply inspired by the FRA treatment, they went a lot further.

My first character in D&D, aged 10, was a Speciality Priest of Mask from FRA. I'll fight anyone who even suggests Mask is dead or ever was dead.

 

[Arnwolf666]

Birthright had good specialty priests too. Most of the later specialty priests were good. The complete priests handbook just came about early before the books started taking a different direction. Although there were still very good things in both books.

 

[Garthanos]

Hmmm I suppose one could give fighters better ability to use magic items in some way if you are trying trying to hearken to the past.

In 4e allowing a martial type to force a magic item to do its daily ability a second time via heroic exertion ie "spending a healing surge" is on my martial practices list. (there are a few cases where this could be problematic but they are i think rare)

 

[Arnwolf666]

Hmmm I suppose one could give fighters better ability to use magic items in some way if you are trying trying to hearken to the past.

In 4e allowing a martial type to force a magic item to do its daily ability a second time via heroic exertion ie "spending a healing surge" is on my martial practices list. (there are a few cases where this could be problematic but they are i think rare)

that would most likely just end up being used for Combat purposes. But I think the purpose of this thread was to give them things outside of combat. I kind of think the best ability that could be given would be something along the lines of leadership and kingdom building. Just my opinion. I may be nostalgic for those days of ruling domains. I really want pathfinders kingmaker for 5E. Something At least along the lines of skills in court.