D&D 5E Further Future D&D Product Speculation

Parmandur

Book-Friend
So, it's been several days since we got the fresh dopamine rush of new D&D product announcements, so clearly it's time to begin the cycle of speculation up again!

I've been mulling over some future possibilities, and then I saw this nugget:

"According to Winninger, the D&D Team is “particularly excited for [the slipcase] format,” and that we were “likely going to see several things in that format” in the coming years."


In addition to this, Winninger said on Twitter that if the battle game "Warriors of Krynn" is successful, they will look at bringing it to other Settings and expanding it.

We know that there is a classic Setting product coming in 2023, a "revisit" to a Classic Setting already covered in 5E for the 50th Anniversaryin 2024 alongside the rules revision, and two brand new Settings thst are not Magic related in development (we also know that the latter are not the Radiant Citadel, because Winninger said so).

In terms of Settings that might be coming in 2023, I think it is safe to eliminate any licensed Setting from the games history, such as Lankhmar, Rokugan, or Hyperborea. It qlso seems reasonable at this point to not expect microsettings, like Ghoatwalk, Jakandor, Nentir Vale, or Council of Worms (but they might have a future with this slipcase model!).

With those caveats, it seems to me that there four viable candidates for the 2023 Classic Setting product: Birthright, Dark Sun, Mystarra, and Planescape.

The candidates for the classic "revisit" would seem to be the Eberron, the Forgotten Realms, and Greyhawk (because Ghoats of Saltmarsh counts as a visit).

Given the excitement from the D&D studio for the slipcase model and the battle game model, I would also see these as falling into two groups: "Slipcase Settings:, and "Battle Game Settings".

Slipcase Settings

it seems to me that Planescape and Greyhawk would be good candidates for slipcase products similar to the Spelljammer set.

Planescape could provide a Planar & Sigil Gazateer, a Planar Monster book, and a tour of the Planes Adventure book, with a poster map of Sigil and the Outlands plus DM screen with Planar info. This could cover most of the basis of the original box set, and plug into most DMs games.

Greyhawk seems like it would also fit this format well for a r: a Gazateer covering more than the original Folio, a book of old school weird Gygaxian Monsters, and Ruins of Castle Greyhawk as an adventure. This seems like it would be perfect as a 50th Anniversary product.

For a revisit, a slipcase set in Ebwrron for Xen'drick might be fun as a dark horse.

Battle System Settings

Dark Sun was initially conceived as a showpiece for the AD&D Battle System war game for mass combat scenarios, with the development codename "Battle World." An Adventure pitting the PCs against the Sorcerer Kings, with an attendant Battle Game tie in seems entirely fitting.

Similarly, Birthright is intimately tied to domain management and large-scale warfare. A book combining Scion PCs ruling domains with a Battle Game tie in would seem appropriate.

Mystarra also has ties to Mass Combat systems, through the War Engine of the Companion Set. This might make Mystarra a solid dark horse candidate.

Anyways, interesting to see what WotC does with these new models moving forward.
 

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darjr

I crit!
I think, but do not know, it’s Greyhawk.

Battle box goes great with it, especially an expansion.
It’s been visited before in Saltmarsh.
It’s an important date.
Luke Gygax would be a fantastic partner.
GaryCon would be an amazing venue to show it off and have a D&D Direct like thing.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
With those caveats, it seems to me that there four viable candidates for the 2023 Classic Setting product: Birthright, Dark Sun, Mystarra, and Planescape.
Of those, only Dark Sun and Planescape rated in their settings survey from the early days of 5E. As much as I’d love Mystara to come back, it’s either Athas or Sigil.

If they’re really wanting to push the mass combat line, Dark Sun and Birthright are the obvious choices. But of those, Dark Sun is wildly more popular.
 


Parmandur

Book-Friend
I think, but do not know, it’s Greyhawk.

Battle box goes great with it, especially an expansion.
It’s been visited before in Saltmarsh.
It’s an important date.
Luke Gygax would be a fantastic partner.
GaryCon would be an amazing venue to show it off and have a D&D Direct like thing.
That's what my gut says, too. Heck, they could do a slipcase like Spelljammer that also ties into a Battle Game, and it would fit Greyhawk. Luke Gygax being involved would be awesome. It really seems to fit yhe new formats better than the Forgotten Realms.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Of those, only Dark Sun and Planescape rated in their settings survey from the early days of 5E. As much as I’d love Mystara to come back, it’s either Athas or Sigil.

If they’re really wanting to push the mass combat line, Dark Sun and Birthright are the obvious choices. But of those, Dark Sun is wildly more popular.
Yeah, I hadn't gotten to fully weighing probabilities in my meanderings, but I'd rate Planescape as the most probable for the 2023 Setting, with a slipcase format: that would also fit with how confident Winninger is about future slipcase, if they are already planning it for Planescape.

If the Battle Game hits it off, I think Dark Sun is the next move. But given a few years, even. Irthright and Mystarra might make an appearance, and a Council of Worms or Jakandor Slipcase might make sense eventually. There are no hard limits.
 



JEB

Legend
@Parmandur:

I formerly thought Dark Sun was going to be the remaining classic setting choice, but I think Planescape is the most likely now. More groundwork has been laid for Planescape, and it continues their emphasis on the multiverse, and it's a more natural fit for post-Tasha 5E's assumptions. Dark Sun, by contrast, would require a fair number of adjustments from core assumptions (defiling magic, psionics, intentional distance from classic D&D tropes, etc.), and reworking the setting to eliminate those risks losing a lot of its flavor (and annoying the setting's veteran fans). The only counterpoint I can think of is the wargame tie-in, but that stopped being a marketing angle for Dark Sun by the time of its 2E revision.

The "revisit" is almost certainly the Forgotten Realms, just in time to tie in with the 2024 revision. It seems widely agreed that SCAG was lacking as a setting book, unlike Eberron. This "revisit" also gives them a chance to make further setting adjustments, to match post-Tasha's shifts.

Both Planescape and the Realms will surely get the slipcase treatment, as you suggest, unless Spelljammer is a total bomb sales-wise.

As for the other settings you mentioned:
  • Greyhawk would be a good setting choice for the 50th anniversary, but either way of handling it poses risks. Make it authentic to the old-school version, and you risk offending newer gamers; revise the setting for newer gamers, and you risk offending old-school fans. What I think we could see instead is something like the Dragonlance adventure - a Castle Greyhawk adventure, as you suggest, with minimal attention to the setting proper. (This is also how the well-regarded Ghosts of Saltmarsh worked for the most part, just define a small section of the setting as an adventure backdrop.)
  • Birthright is too obscure to make a comeback in any form. (Sorry, fans, nothing wrong with the setting but I'm just being frank.)
  • Mystara could be interesting as the focus for an adventure/mini-setting like Dragonlance, but the most recent thing it's known for now is those re-releases of the Capcom video games from years ago. Not to mention that Wizards would probably prefer folks not dig too much into some of its setting lore.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Yeah, I hadn't gotten to fully weighing probabilities in my meanderings, but I'd rate Planescape as the most probable for the 2023 Setting, with a slipcase format: that would also fit with how confident Winninger is about future slipcase, if they are already planning it for Planescape.
At a guess the cliffhanger adventure for Planescape will be Tales from the Infinite Staircase, or similar. Though I really hope whatever other settings get the slipcase treatment don't also have to deal with the reduced page count.
If the Battle Game hits it off, I think Dark Sun is the next move. But given a few years, even. Irthright and Mystara might make an appearance, and a Council of Worms or Jakandor Slipcase might make sense eventually.
Maybe. Who knows? Outside of the D&D folks, that is.
There are no hard limits.
Well, no...but we can make educated guesses. The likelihood of getting a Birthright setting book is likely much lower than getting a Dark Sun or Planescape book. Or at least if it's going to happen they're going to work through most or all of the more popular settings first.
 

and two brand new Settings thst are not Magic related in development (we also know that the latter are not the Radiant Citadel, because Winninger said so)
I don't follow WotC anywhere online, I usually pick up bits and pieces of news from them here. Did Winnegar say these new settings will not contain anything from/have no connection to Radiant Citadel? After watching the video today on the adventures in the Radiant Citadel it seems like theres alot of unexplored cultures in that book that D&D hasnt covered that could be expanded upon for a future full campaign setting.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
At a guess the cliffhanger adventure for Planescape will be Tales from the Infinite Staircase, or similar. Though I really hope whatever other settings get the slipcase treatment don't also have to deal with the reduced page count.

Maybe. Who knows? Outside of the D&D folks, that is.

Well, no...but we can make educated guesses. The likelihood of getting a Birthright setting book is likely much lower than getting a Dark Sun or Planescape book. Or at least if it's going to happen they're going to work through most or all of the more popular settings first.
Perkins has spent years pushing Modrons and the Great Modron March here and there: a Modron March Redux would fit the "Planar Locale of the Week" model. Some more pages would be nice.

Thing is, at the rate they are going, they will have covered all of the most popular Settings in a few years, and made a few new ones. Returning to an old Setting with some fans is a way to generate a little buzz. Given strange Aeons...
 

JEB

Legend
I don't follow WotC anywhere online, I usually pick up bits and pieces of news from them here. Did Winnegar say these new settings will not contain anything from/have no connection to Radiant Citadel? After watching the video today on the adventures in the Radiant Citadel it seems like theres alot of unexplored cultures in that book that D&D hasnt covered that could be expanded upon for a future full campaign setting.
I would also be interested in a citation of Winninger saying the new settings aren't connected to the Citadel. Don't we have larger gazetteers for two settings in the new book? Seemed obvious to me that was a sneak preview of the two new settings.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
@Parmandur:

I formerly thought Dark Sun was going to be the remaining classic setting choice, but I think Planescape is the most likely now.
Yeah, I hate to admit it, but I agree. They likely stopped working on Dark Sun when they gave up on psionics. Without a fair amount of work on those, it doesn't seem likely Dark Sun is on the way.
More groundwork has been laid for Planescape, and it continues their emphasis on the multiverse, and it's a more natural fit for post-Tasha 5E's assumptions.
Absolutely.
Dark Sun, by contrast, would require a fair number of adjustments from core assumptions (defiling magic, psionics, intentional distance from classic D&D tropes, etc.),
Defiling is easy to do. Give advantage on an attack, disadvantage on a save, or a free up cast when you defile. It doesn't need to be more complicated than that. As long as it's tempting, it'll get used. Psionics are about as done as they're going to get, I think, for this edition. They might give it another push, but their last attempt floundered. It's that last one that's the biggest hurdle. D&D + something new is fine. D&D - something old is not going to fly. 5E is not the restrictions edition. Unfortunately, Dark Sun is the restrictions setting. It basically defines it. You couldn't pull that off, not from the current design team, without undermining either the edition or the setting. WotC is clearly ready, willing, and able to undermine settings if it means catering to the wider fanbase.
and reworking the setting to eliminate those risks losing a lot of its flavor (and annoying the setting's veteran fans).
Not to put too fine a point on it, but they've made it plain that they don't care. If they can radically alter classic settings and get even a good-sized chunk of the new fanbase to buy in, that will blow the grognards out of the water every time. They don't need to cater to the old fans anymore. They haven't in years. New people will be interested in the new versions of the classic settings, and given the size of current D&D fandom, that will be more than enough.
The "revisit" is almost certainly the Forgotten Realms, just in time to tie in with the 2024 revision. It seems widely agreed that SCAG was lacking as a setting book, unlike Eberron. This "revisit" also gives them a chance to make further setting adjustments, to match post-Tasha's shifts.
That does seem the most likely. Or Greyhawk.
Both Planescape and the Realms will surely get the slipcase treatment, as you suggest, unless Spelljammer is a total bomb sales-wise.
Well, it hit #5 top seller on Amazon by Friday afternoon, so it's not likely to bomb.
As for the other settings you mentioned:
  • Greyhawk would be a good setting choice for the 50th anniversary, but either way of handling it poses risks. Make it authentic to the old-school version, and you risk offending newer gamers; revise the setting for newer gamers, and you risk offending old-school fans. What I think we could see instead is something like the Dragonlance adventure - a Castle Greyhawk adventure, as you suggest, with minimal attention to the setting proper. (This is also how the well-regarded Ghosts of Saltmarsh worked for the most part, just define a small section of the setting as an adventure backdrop.)
Yeah, that does seem likely. Maybe the same treatment as Dragonlance, an adventure path and a mass battle game.
  • Birthright is too obscure to make a comeback in any form. (Sorry, fans, nothing wrong with the setting but I'm just being frank.)
Well, unless you ignore the whole origin of the name and the divine right to rule angle. It's not going to fly with modern audiences at all.
  • Mystara could be interesting as the focus for an adventure/mini-setting like Dragonlance, but the most recent thing it's known for now is those re-releases of the Capcom video games from years ago. Not to mention that Wizards would probably prefer folks not dig too much into some of its setting lore.
Exactly. Like Birthright, it's not likely without a radical overhaul.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I don't follow WotC anywhere online, I usually pick up bits and pieces of news from them here. Did Winnegar say these new settings will not contain anything from/have no connection to Radiant Citadel? After watching the video today on the adventures in the Radiant Citadel it seems like theres alot of unexplored cultures in that book that D&D hasnt covered that could be expanded upon for a future full campaign setting.
Well, first he hinted in 2020 that two Settings were in development, and clarified thst they were not Magic related, but original D&D Settings. Then recently, he clarified that Radiant Citadel is not related to these two.

The best guess anybof us have come up with is that Wirchlight might be a preview of a sort of Alice in Wonderland, Fey mirror of Ravenloft, with the Domains if Delight with Fey Lord's instead of Domains of Dread with Dread Lord's. We'll see...
 
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I would also be interested in a citation of Winninger saying the new settings aren't connected to the Citadel. Don't we have larger gazetteers for two settings in the new book? Seemed obvious to me that was a sneak preview of the two new settings.
Only thing I know is what I saw in the video I believe was released yesterday/today interviewing various writers.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
The "revisit" is almost certainly the Forgotten Realms, just in time to tie in with the 2024 revision. It seems widely agreed that SCAG was lacking as a setting book, unlike Eberron. This "revisit" also gives them a chance to make further setting adjustments, to match post-Tasha's shifts.
SCAG has sold very well, and consistently. I am skeptical that there is that much need for a ForgotteReqlms Setting product, whereas Greyhawk is a perfect 50th Anniversary Setting. If Luke Gygax was involved, they could have their Grognard cake and eat it too by expanding to a broader and younger audience.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I would also be interested in a citation of Winninger saying the new settings aren't connected to the Citadel. Don't we have larger gazetteers for two settings in the new book? Seemed obvious to me that was a sneak preview of the two new settings.
Sure thing, right here:


Radiant Citadel contains Gazateers for 16 Settings (the Citzdel in the Deep Etheral, and 15 different Prime Material worlds), but these are all seeds it seems. I hope the designers flesh then out on the DMsGuild or something!
 

Well, first he hinted in 2020 that two Settings were in development, and clarified thst they were not Magic related, but original D&D Settings. Then recently, he clarified that Radiant Citadel is not related to these two.
You seem to have a good handle on these things so it seems they probably are too new(er) settings. As WotC is looking for more inclusiveness I suppose they could change their minds, anythings possible. One of these could be a new Oriental setting book perhaps.
 


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