GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 5

As much as it would be awesome to see the last two books come out quickly once the series came out, I don’t think that’s likely. His last two books took, what 11 years to write, and he’s only gotten slower since then.

Besides, I doubt Bantam Books would be okay with this, considering how overdue The Winds of Winter is. Maybe if HBO dumped a giant pile of money in front of them…

I read an article today that the actor who played Ser Baristan Selmy said that Martin was finished with both book 6 and 7, but had a deal with HBO not to release them until after the series was over. I have no idea if that's true or not, but it's a very interesting thing for him to say.
 

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Sadras

Legend
Well he has publicly stated on his Not-A-Blog-Site that the rumour that he has finished book 6 and 7 is emphatically not true. In fact he states that he has not even begun book 7.
 

It was entertaining, yes. I have some serious criticisms about it, however. Mainly in the fact that the sudden transformation into madness for Danaerys wasn't believable for me. Yes, I know that she has been showing signs of this over the past few episodes, and my criticism is also tempered by the fact that the show-runners are actually limited on the number of episodes and time to show this plot development. The snap into a murderous rage for me just didn't click, though.
Well, Dumb & Dumber brought that on themselves. HBO wanted Season 8 to have more episodes, but Dumb & Dumber refused.
 

hawkeyefan

Legend
Ramped up pacing with logical sense thrown in sure...but this was senseless.

I also disagree with @hawkeyefan with his (and I'm going to say it) apologist view of the scorpion use. Again this goes back to what feels 'more real'

I said that the portrayal of the scorpion use could have been handled better. The angles could have been clearer or a line of dialogue could have been added to help clarify what was happening.

I simply don’t think that the lack of clarity is as egregious as many others. Nor do I think it’s something entirely new. Plenty of examples of it prior to the last couple of seasons.

And I agree that the pace of things is a bit rushed. I would have been happy for there to be a few more episodes in order to expand on things a bit. Make them feel more organic.

All that said, however, I’m just not going to let this minor stuff truly affect my view of the show. I would say that when things are a bit unclear, I tend to give a charitable view. Others prefer to do the opposite.

I’m also willing to let the creators tell the story they want to tell. I don’t get mad that they don’t follow the path I’ve thought up in my head.

In my opinion, a lot of the criticisms seem to come from that more than anything, or that they are enhanced because of that. “THIS ISN’T WHAT I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE, IT’S THEREFORE TERRIBLE!”

I have plenty of criticisms about the show. Always have. I just don’t let them do that weird fanboy heel turn thing where they make me hate something I’ve enjoyed for many years.
 

Sadras

Legend
All that said, however, I’m just not going to let this minor stuff truly affect my view of the show.

I have to ask then, what would be major then, in your estimation? I'm curious where your line is drawn.

EDIT: Furthermore I think at this point (season 8) some of us have been more than a little charitable, especially given the last few seasons. It isn't just one episode or one season that has been a clustercluck so forgive me if I don't share the lets poo-poo on the fanboys for their attitudes.
For me it is about common sense and consistency (in character and other). That has been sorely lacking for a while. The chorus is getting louder these days. :)
 
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This. It's possible to enjoy something and still be critical of it. There are parts of Game of Thrones that I think could be done better, but I still love the show.

Hatewatching only feeds fandom toxicity.

I have plenty of criticisms about the show. Always have. I just don’t let them do that weird fanboy heel turn thing where they make me hate something I’ve enjoyed for many years.
 

hawkeyefan

Legend
I have to ask then, what would be major then, in your estimation? I'm curious where your line is drawn.

I'm not sure, really. I'd have to see it to know it. But I think it would be something that was very concretely contradictory rather than just poorly presented. To use the Scorpion example....I can believe that the Iron Fleet could hit a flying dragon who was not expecting their attack, and I can believe that Dany and Drogon could effectively attack and defeat the Iron Fleet despite their Scorpions. The conditions are different in the two events, so I don't see them as contradictory. I don't think the first was portrayed very well, but I don't think that a matter of presentation is the kind of thing I'm talking about.

To use another example....I would have gone (and expected them to go) in a very different route with regard to Jaime. I think in the books, it's very likely that Jaime will help the Hound defeat the Mountain (pretty sure Dany has a vision of this in the House of the Undying; something about "a golden knight and a hound fighting a giant knight with armor made of stone", paraphrasing, but that's the gist) and then he'll go on to actually kill Cersei (fulfilling the prophecy of the little brother). He'll be faced with a similar choice as to the one he faced with the Mad King, and he'll make the same choice, because he knows it's right. That's the arc I wanted for him, and the one I think he's on in the books (if Stoneheart can somehow let go of her hate, I suppose.....maybe someday we'll find out).

However, the show went a different route. Jaime remains faithful to Cersei despite the influence of Brienne. He simply cannot move past the horrible things he's done, and so he thinks he belongs with Cersei rather than a worthy person like Brienne. Then he has his chat with Tyrion, and he essentially sets out to try and save Cersei in order to redeem her. I think he genuinely wanted to simply escape with her and live their life with the baby quietly for the rest of their days. Obviously, it wasn't to be so.

This is a different route than I would have taken, but I don't think it's at all inconsistent with what we've seen in the show. Book Jaime has a much more definitive falling out with Cersei that Show Jaime never has. I don't have a problem with the show's interpretation of this simply because it doesn't match my expectations.

EDIT: Furthermore I think at this point (season 8) some of us have been more than a little charitable, especially given the last few seasons. It isn't just one episode or one season that has been a clustercluck so forgive me if I don't share the lets poo-poo on the fanboys for their attitudes.
For me it is about common sense and consistency (in character and other). That has been sorely lacking for a while. The chorus is getting louder these days. :)

That's fine. You are absolutely entitled to your opinion. I expect I even share some of your opinions about the show. But may I ask, if the show has let you down so much, why do you still watch?

I try to temper my expectations with the realities of production of a show on this scale, and with trying to complete the story in the amount of episodes that remain. I'd have preferred a few more episodes so that things don't feel so rushed, but that was not to be. We can guess as to why, but likely our guesses will fall far short of the complexity that goes into a film production of this scope. "Just make more episodes" is a pretty easy thing to demand, and quite another to actually produce.

I do think that there's a strange phenomenon that happens with fans sometimes where they create expectations that will simply never be reached. And then very often what happens is that valid criticism ("the pacing of later seasons seems a bit too fast") is replaced by insult ("Dumb & Dumber have brought this on themselves"). You can see it in this thread, and you can see much more of it elsewhere online.
 

Tonguez

A suffusion of yellow
it was better than last weeks shocker, the battle made sense, was big and bloody and it was day time so I could see stuff.

Dany has always had a draconian streak but her descent to madness could have perhaps been better explored. However the dragon going nuclear after being so useless last episode was disappointing and other than psychosis it made no sense burning the town rather than flying straight to the Red Keep and completely destroying it and everyone inside - including all the innocents held there.

Also tending to believe now that Arya is Azor Ahai and will kill a fiery dragon
 
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jonesy

A Wicked Kendragon
[video=youtube;CpTZ-tC81yA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpTZ-tC81yA[/video]


Edit: meant to post this in the What Are You Listening To? thread. They released it two days ago. :D
 
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