GC 2006 - Ptolus Hardback $120!?!

[WildWeasel]

Because that $20 a month is already being spent on current RPG books?

Wah. Really, just wah. If someone can't be bothered to save up a bit for something becuase they have to have something new every month, that's their own problem. Full stop.

 

[Varianor Abroad]

I was looking at the art for the book and noticed that the image of The Ageless Titan (row 2 column 2) has what look like sibeccai. Is this a hint that there is Arcana Evolved tie in to Ptolus? Or was this just flavor imagery. Personally I would prefer (since I paid the full $120 for the presale) that all the text in the 1000+ total pages (including CD-ROM stuff) be set for d20 3.5, not AE, even though I like AE. I am paying for d20 3.5, I hope.

Maybe I just missed something here.

Catsclaw

There are sibeccai in some of the Ptolus campaign logs. They are a very minor race in that setting. Litorians existed in Ptolus well before Monte wrote AE. He developed them in Ptolus. There will be a short AE conversion (mentioned on www.ptolus.com). But you're not buying AE or a significant chunk of AE content in Ptolus. You are buying a book that with a tad of work could be plunked into an AE or a regular 3.5 game with no troubles.

 

[WildWeasel]

At the risk of further flames, IMHO I think Monte charging such an excessive amount for Ptolus is rediculous. Again IMHO This is an attempt to cash in on his name while it's still hot. I wonder how far this book would go if it was under a different yet equally capable author's name.
ENworld (fans and brass alike) may not like hearing this type of comment about a fan-favorite author as well as the head of Malhavoc etc. but Im posting my piece on a public forum. I cant wait to see the reviews when its finally released.

WHY is it "excessive" and "rediculous"?

 

[catsclaw227]

There are sibeccai in some of the Ptolus campaign logs. They are a very minor race in that setting. Litorians existed in Ptolus well before Monte wrote AE. He developed them in Ptolus. There will be a short AE conversion (mentioned on www.ptolus.com). But you're not buying AE or a significant chunk of AE content in Ptolus. You are buying a book that with a tad of work could be plunked into an AE or a regular 3.5 game with no troubles.

Thanks. I should read through the Ptolus adventure logs again. It has been a while. Either way, I was just now thinking of adding sibeccai and litorians anyway. In my 1E and 2E days I always had a Lion-like race (Lionels) so I've just been waiting for the right time to add them to the homebrew I am cooking up. Ptolus will be perfect, with CSIO, Bluffside, Freeport and all my favorites. (even the old unknown -- Blackwater from Ronin Arts -- very cool)

I just didn't want my massive volume of pages taken up with conversion info.

Catsclaw

 

[Michael Morris]

I'm bowing out folks. I've said all I have to say regarding this.

 

[Sunderstone]

WHY is it "excessive" and "rediculous"?

A comparison...

On one of my shopping impulses, today I picked up WotC's Stormwrack. Nothing major, just a $35 (cover price) "environmental" book. I spent a little over an hour looking it over before I got online. The book is very well designed IMO and its kind of making me take a bigger look at Freeport now from Green Ronin. Im starting to think Ocean going seperate campaign and integrating it all to the Forgotten Realms. I really was impressed with Stormwrack (as I was with Frostburn but not as much with Sandstorm).

My point is....The $35 environmental book has everything for Players as well as DMs (Prestige Classes, Rules, Scenarios, Monsters, etc), the typical price tag, and good authors. Why would I want to pay almost 4x more for Ptolus?
I like Ptolus in concept, and I absolutely love Banewarrens (which I would love to see updated to 3.5 someday) theres no way Im paying $120 for it. A 3.5 updated version of Banewarrens would definately be a plus..... still not worth the price of admission.

Before anyone chimes in about seperate $30-40 books, Yes they are worth it to me. Picking up Stormwrack and the Freeport HC will still be cheaper than Ptolus and each can be used seperately.

 

[WildWeasel]

A comparison...

On one of my shopping impulses, today I picked up WotC's Stormwrack. Nothing major, just a $35 (cover price) "environmental" book. I spent a little over an hour looking it over before I got online. The book is very well designed IMO and its kind of making me take a bigger look at Freeport now from Green Ronin. Im starting to think Ocean going seperate campaign and integrating it all to the Forgotten Realms. I really was impressed with Stormwrack (as I was with Frostburn but not as much with Sandstorm).

My point is....The $35 environmental book has everything for Players as well as DMs (Prestige Classes, Rules, Scenarios, Monsters, etc), the typical price tag, and good authors. Why would I want to pay almost 4x more for Ptolus?
I like Ptolus in concept, and I absolutely love Banewarrens (which I would love to see updated to 3.5 someday) theres no way Im paying $120 for it. A 3.5 updated version of Banewarrens would definately be a plus..... still not worth the price of admission.

Before anyone chimes in about seperate $30-40 books, Yes they are worth it to me. Picking up Stormwrack and the Freeport HC will still be cheaper than Ptolus and each can be used seperately.

In other words, you don't think Ptolus offers $120 worth of utility to you. That doesn't make it "excessive" or "rediculous". It means its not a useful product for you to spend your money on. Two completely different things. People are willing to spend 4x as much on Ptolus becuase they believe it will offer them at least 4x the utility of a single $30 book. And if it does, then how is it being "excessive"?

And the seperate $30-40 dollar books is kind of key here. Ptolus isn't offering any less content than $120 worth of supplements. The difference is that you have $120 worth of potential purchase in one chunk you have to evaluate first, rather than three or four chunks. But in the end, you are still spending $120 dollars on gaming stuff, be it as one gigabook or three or four regular books. And if that gigabook offers as much content and utility as the bundle of regular books, then what's the difference?

Yes, Ptolous is priced past the point of being an impulse buy, like Stormwrack was for you. But I kind of doubt that MC expects anyone to pick up Ptolus on an impulse. Is it a lot of money to spend and it turns out you don't like it? Yeah. But it's alot, regardless of if it's one book or four.

 

[Sunderstone]

If Stormwrack was priced at $60 it would have stayed on the shelf. I love the book, but not so much to spend $120 regardless of extras and page count. The Shackled City HC was $60, also expensive but worth it (even though I already have every Dungeon mag with the seperate adventures).
Would I spend $120 on the Shackled City hardcover...... no way in hell. That would be excessive, even though its my favorite 3.5 product to date.

 

[WildWeasel]

If Stormwrack was priced at $60 it would have stayed on the shelf. I love the book, but not so much to spend $120 regardless of extras and page count. The Shackled City HC was $60, also expensive but worth it (even though I already have every Dungeon mag with the seperate adventures).
Would I spend $120 on the Shackled City hardcover...... no way in hell. That would be excessive, even though its my favorite 3.5 product to date.

So what made Shackled City worth $60 and not Stormwrack?

 

[catsclaw227]

Yes, Ptolous is priced past the point of being an impulse buy, like Stormwrack was for you. But I kind of doubt that MC expects anyone to pick up Ptolus on an impulse. Is it a lot of money to spend and it turns out you don't like it? Yeah. But it's alot, regardless of if it's one book or four.

I paid for it on impluse, but I am a sick rpg-impulse buyer extraordinaire. I buy it all on impulse, but I do consider the source and in some cases reviews. But when I stack 3-4 books in an FRP games or Amazon shopping cart, or grab 10 PDFs from RPGNow.com or DrivethruRPG, I am definately impulse buying.

I bought Ptolus now, instead of in 9 months, on impulse. But that doesn't take anything away from the fact that I believe it is 100% worth it. Malhavoc has a history of quality, I have always liked Ptolus, and I GM. My players will certainly get $120 of value from it and if they do, then I do. That's why I GM.