Geas: the good, the bad, the funny
- Thread starter roguerouge
- Start date
Oni
First Post
Hypersmurf said:
Fine. I'll get you a Pepsi.
Of course how is totally up to the person beyond any specifics given at the time of the Geas. I have several things I have to do first in order to be able to properly pursue the needed course to get you your pepsi. Who knows where you might go during that time. In fact it would probably be easier to bring you your pepsi if I knew your exact location. Hurm...If I kill you and leave your corpse here it'll be much easier for me to find you and deliver the pepsi you requested. Excellent we've established step one to your pepsi request...your death.
roguerouge
First Post
Which brings us back to one of the original questions I had. In light of recent postings, it might be rephrased as: "What are effective uses of geas to force someone to fetch a Pepsi in such a manner that does not end with your death."
I agree with the poster on their reading of geas. The recipient must follow the instructions and receives penalties only if prevented from following the instruction by another. The only thing that balances this no save spell is the cunning target standard, who imprisons the caster to follow the instruction to keep the caster safe.
The appeal for the player and the dm with this spell seems to me to be that it starts a battle of wits: can you outsmart the other while still remaining true to the letter of the instructions vs. can you craft an airtight set of instructions.
What prompted me to post a question on this was the fact that in a recent game, my enchanter geased an opponent, who found a loophole, and thus geased the PC back. Thus began the battle of wits.... As I am inherently at a disadvantage in such battles, both as a player and as a DM, I posted this question!
rougerouge
I agree with the poster on their reading of geas. The recipient must follow the instructions and receives penalties only if prevented from following the instruction by another. The only thing that balances this no save spell is the cunning target standard, who imprisons the caster to follow the instruction to keep the caster safe.
The appeal for the player and the dm with this spell seems to me to be that it starts a battle of wits: can you outsmart the other while still remaining true to the letter of the instructions vs. can you craft an airtight set of instructions.
What prompted me to post a question on this was the fact that in a recent game, my enchanter geased an opponent, who found a loophole, and thus geased the PC back. Thus began the battle of wits.... As I am inherently at a disadvantage in such battles, both as a player and as a DM, I posted this question!
rougerouge
roguerouge
First Post
Which brings us back to one of the original questions I had. In light of recent postings, it might be rephrased as: "What are effective uses of geas to force someone to fetch a Pepsi in such a manner that does not end with your death."
I agree with the poster on their reading of geas. The recipient must follow the instructions and receives penalties only if prevented from following the instruction by another. The only thing that balances this no save spell is the cunning target standard, who imprisons the caster to follow the instruction to keep the caster safe.
The appeal for the player and the dm with this spell seems to me to be that it starts a battle of wits: can you outsmart the other while still remaining true to the letter of the instructions vs. can you craft an airtight set of instructions.
What prompted me to post a question on this was the fact that in a recent game, my enchanter geased an opponent, who found a loophole, and thus geased the PC back. Thus began the battle of wits.... As I am inherently at a disadvantage in such battles, both as a player and as a DM, I posted this question!
roguerouge
I agree with the poster on their reading of geas. The recipient must follow the instructions and receives penalties only if prevented from following the instruction by another. The only thing that balances this no save spell is the cunning target standard, who imprisons the caster to follow the instruction to keep the caster safe.
The appeal for the player and the dm with this spell seems to me to be that it starts a battle of wits: can you outsmart the other while still remaining true to the letter of the instructions vs. can you craft an airtight set of instructions.
What prompted me to post a question on this was the fact that in a recent game, my enchanter geased an opponent, who found a loophole, and thus geased the PC back. Thus began the battle of wits.... As I am inherently at a disadvantage in such battles, both as a player and as a DM, I posted this question!
roguerouge
Voadam
Legend
for reference
from the 3.5 srd:
Geas/Quest
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 6, Clr 6, Sor/Wiz 6
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Target: One living creature
Saving Throw: None
This spell functions similarly to lesser geas, except that it affects a creature of any HD and allows no saving throw.
Instead of taking penalties to ability scores (as with lesser geas), the subject takes 3d6 points of damage each day it does not attempt to follow the geas/quest. Additionally, each day it must make a Fortitude saving throw or become sickened. These effects end 24 hours after the creature attempts to resume the geas/ quest.
A remove curse spell ends a geas/quest spell only if its caster level is at least two higher than your caster level. Break enchantment does not end a geas/quest, but limited wish, miracle, and wish do.
Bards, sorcerers, and wizards usually refer to this spell as geas, while clerics call the same spell quest.
Geas, Lesser
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 3, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: One living creature with 7 HD or less
Duration: One day/level or until discharged (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates
Spell Resistance: Yes
A lesser geas places a magical command on a creature to carry out some service or to refrain from some action or course of activity, as desired by you. The creature must have 7 or fewer Hit Dice and be able to understand you. While a geas cannot compel a creature to kill itself or perform acts that would result in certain death, it can cause almost any other course of activity.
The geased creature must follow the given instructions until the geas is completed, no matter how long it takes.
If the instructions involve some open-ended task that the recipient cannot complete through his own actions the spell remains in effect for a maximum of one day per caster level. A clever recipient can subvert some instructions:
If the subject is prevented from obeying the lesser geas for 24 hours, it takes a –2 penalty to each of its ability scores. Each day, another –2 penalty accumulates, up to a total of –8. No ability score can be reduced to less than 1 by this effect. The ability score penalties are removed 24 hours after the subject resumes obeying the lesser geas.
A lesser geas (and all ability score penalties) can be ended by break enchantment, limited wish, remove curse, miracle, or wish. Dispel magic does not affect a lesser geas.
from the 3.5 srd:
Geas/Quest
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 6, Clr 6, Sor/Wiz 6
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Target: One living creature
Saving Throw: None
This spell functions similarly to lesser geas, except that it affects a creature of any HD and allows no saving throw.
Instead of taking penalties to ability scores (as with lesser geas), the subject takes 3d6 points of damage each day it does not attempt to follow the geas/quest. Additionally, each day it must make a Fortitude saving throw or become sickened. These effects end 24 hours after the creature attempts to resume the geas/ quest.
A remove curse spell ends a geas/quest spell only if its caster level is at least two higher than your caster level. Break enchantment does not end a geas/quest, but limited wish, miracle, and wish do.
Bards, sorcerers, and wizards usually refer to this spell as geas, while clerics call the same spell quest.
Geas, Lesser
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 3, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: One living creature with 7 HD or less
Duration: One day/level or until discharged (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates
Spell Resistance: Yes
A lesser geas places a magical command on a creature to carry out some service or to refrain from some action or course of activity, as desired by you. The creature must have 7 or fewer Hit Dice and be able to understand you. While a geas cannot compel a creature to kill itself or perform acts that would result in certain death, it can cause almost any other course of activity.
The geased creature must follow the given instructions until the geas is completed, no matter how long it takes.
If the instructions involve some open-ended task that the recipient cannot complete through his own actions the spell remains in effect for a maximum of one day per caster level. A clever recipient can subvert some instructions:
If the subject is prevented from obeying the lesser geas for 24 hours, it takes a –2 penalty to each of its ability scores. Each day, another –2 penalty accumulates, up to a total of –8. No ability score can be reduced to less than 1 by this effect. The ability score penalties are removed 24 hours after the subject resumes obeying the lesser geas.
A lesser geas (and all ability score penalties) can be ended by break enchantment, limited wish, remove curse, miracle, or wish. Dispel magic does not affect a lesser geas.
roguerouge
First Post
Argh. Dratted double posts...
roguerouge
roguerouge
der_kluge
Adventurer
You could extrapolate this discussion to the "suggestion" spell, which is similar. My sorceress had that, and made good use of it.
My friend suggested that buy a Rubik's cube, toss it to the enemy, and "suggest" "Solve this.".
That would keep them busy for a while.
My favorite suggestion was to tell an ice giant in the arctic to "fetch me a shrubbery".
My friend suggested that buy a Rubik's cube, toss it to the enemy, and "suggest" "Solve this.".
That would keep them busy for a while.
My favorite suggestion was to tell an ice giant in the arctic to "fetch me a shrubbery".
reapersaurus
Explorer
That is such a weak rules argument.Voadam said:
If you take this approach (sans common sense), adjudicating D&D can become very hard.
Geas is 3 levels higher of spell. Those 3 levels are because it doesn't have a save. To make it less powerful than a 3rd level spell based on text that is NOT there, is ludicrous.
