D&D (2024) Gold & Other Treasure (Can we get off the treadmill?)

[Micah Sweet]

Thanks for reminding me about this book. I'm sure I had it back in the 2e days. It may have stayed with me in spirit and coloured why I am so dissatisfied with 5e's equipment lists. I mean, I appreciate the attempt at simplicity, but I am desperate for more depth.

Looks like I should pick it up on DMs guild.

I just wish I still had my physical copy.

 

[Composer99]

Since the game has for 50 years mostly centered on one of (1) stealing loot from monsters you didn't want to fight, (2) killing monsters in order to get their loot, or (3) heroically defeating monsters and consequently getting whatever loot they happened to have (because it was there), I concur that it is a flaw in the game's design and not the fault of DMs if the game does not provide ways for player characters to spend the loot they have ransacked.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Well, I don't think modern playstyles account for 99% of all D&D players, but otherwise I unfortunately have to agree.

Heh heh... well as a whole you're probably right, although I bet if we were to ask 100 players something specific about old-school like "How many of you use Encumbrance in 5E?" we might very well throw a perfect 100!

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Unlike prior editions, you can actually run a full campaign without non-magical treasure. However, there's always ways to spend gold. The two most common are Potions of Healing and expensive spell components. Potions of Healing can allow you to full heal after a combat without spending precious spell slots or taking an hour for a Short Rest. Some of the best spells have expensive spell components, many of which are consumed on use. Diamonds for Revivify/Raise Dead and Greater Restoration are by far the most sought after, but Identify requires a pearl, Augury requires expensive rune stones (or other divination tool), and many more.

Lack of easy access to magic items, including potions, talismans with "spell in a can" etc, have deepened the martial/caster divide, because now it either comes from your class, or you may as well not have it. Martials are expected to have magic weapons/items, otherwise they suffer disproportionately to enemies with resistances.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I just wish I still had my physical copy.

Thanks again for the recommendation. I picked it up on DM's Guild, and it's a delight. Not only does it bring back the memories (I definitely owned it, I recognize so much of the art!) but it's a delight to read. Very funny. IIRC it was one of the earliest reference books to be written in-character.

Some interesting ideas there for equipment, too.

 

[Shiroiken]

Lack of easy access to magic items, including potions, talismans with "spell in a can" etc, have deepened the martial/caster divide, because now it either comes from your class, or you may as well not have it. Martials are expected to have magic weapons/items, otherwise they suffer disproportionately to enemies with resistances.

This is twice now I've been misquoted. I specifically said "non-magical treasure," which is the topic of the OP. I said nothing about magic items. For those not following, this is my quote below (emphasis added).

Unlike prior editions, you can actually run a full campaign without non-magical treasure. However, there's always ways to spend gold. The two most common are Potions of Healing and expensive spell components. Potions of Healing can allow you to full heal after a combat without spending precious spell slots or taking an hour for a Short Rest. Some of the best spells have expensive spell components, many of which are consumed on use. Diamonds for Revivify/Raise Dead and Greater Restoration are by far the most sought after, but Identify requires a pearl, Augury requires expensive rune stones (or other divination tool), and many more.

 

[Edgar Ironpelt]

just have magic items for sale and it's all good.

There are a few different ways magic items can be for sale.

All the usual and many of the unusual magic items may be freely available "off the shelf."

Magic items might be available by commission; you can "special order" an item and have it made for you, personally.

You can pray and make offerings to the Gawds, and in response (if your offerings were large enough) you will just happen to find the magic item you desire on your next adventure.

A thin and possibly random selection of magic items might be available for sale, and you can buy what's on offer, or wait and wait until what you actually want happens to turn up.

My personal preference as both a player and GM is for for commissioned items, custom made just for you. My players don't always share that preference, however.

One idea I'm considering for my next campaign is to have a thin and randomly changing selection of magic items being available for sale, with the prices for these being heavily discounted. (To about 10% of the 'book' value.) Items acquired as treasure can be sold at this discounted price, or held in hopes of getting a full price - each month roll a 1% chance that an NPC will pay full price for the item. Similarly, it's possible to get just the item you want by paying full price instead of the common discounted on. You can commission the item or find someone with the item who wants full price for it.

Of course I'll have to cut back on the coin and other mundane valuables handed out as treasure if I implement this.

 

[Scott Christian]

While I have played in campaigns where treasure becomes meaningless, I have played in a lot more where it is an extremely useful item, especially gold. I really think this all boils down to how the DM sets it up. One campaign (0-20), where I thought by 15th level this gold is meaningless, turned out to be priceless. Several other campaigns had areas we used as base or towns where we collectively tried to help and become better places or keep secure. Gold, and even side adventured that procured a consistent income, like clearing a mine and then getting a % each month, those things worked in those games very well.

I guess it is all individual, but even more than that, it is up to the DM. Heck, my character in our campaign right now is 7th level and still doesn't have plate armor - and we are running Candlekeep!

 

[Clint_L]

Reflecting more on this topic, I think I am going to leave most day-to-day money issues to the players to decide in the context of the story. For example, if they want to stay at an inn, bribe an informant, or buy a new chain shirt, I will just let them decide whether that fits with their character's story.

However, I would like treasure to remain a viable motivation in terms of accumulating scarce resources like magic items, particularly expensive equipment or abodes, and so on. So I am thinking that I just need a single, large, unit of currency that I can call "wealth." I can peg 1 wealth at, say, 250 gold. Thus, a revivify or basic magic item can cost 1 wealth, and so on, but we won't have to worry about tracking coinage, value in gems, etc. and will let the story determine most day-to-day transactions.

And now, for your entertainment, I present a shopping scene from Critical Role:

 

[nevin]

It's been oft lamented that treasure becomes essentially meaningless very quickly in 5th edition D&D. At least it's oft lamented by me. I ran my first 5th edition campaign in 2014 or 2015, and just accumulating treasure off of monsters and foes, even at lower levels, kept the party hip deep in more gold than they really knew what to do with. There were no magic shops, they weren't spending gold to advance in level, they were itinerant adventurers so real estate wasn't an option, and we were really more focused on old school style adventuring. Even when I ran Acquisitions Inc., a few years later, gold was essentially meaningless as it was trivially easy to make enough of it to keep the business afloat and to make improvements.

How important is treasure in a campaign really? Don't get me wrong, I might have characters who are highly motivated by treasure, but as a player, I don't really care about treasure. It doesn't matter to me if I find five gems with 50 gp each or a statuette made out of electrum. In Honor Among Thieves, the obsession with the acquisition of wealth wasn't the motivation for our heroes (I'm not going to spoil the plot for anyone who hasn't seen it yet), and it's not necessarily the motivation of many protagonist from various fantasy movies and novels.

Is the revision of 5th edition (I threw up a little calling it a revision) going to feature less treasure or provide DMs and players with more options on how to use treasure?

i hope not. In all the games i run and play in treasure feeds our out of game activities. We get keeps and orders and buy off councilmen all the things you'd do in the realworld. the game you describe would simply make me quit DND forever.