Good & Bad : Wizards

[DracoSuave]

Icy Terrain + Rogues = Good Times.

For the War Wizards, Icy Terrain to keep the enemies clumped, followed by an AoE is good times.

For -any- wizard, Thunderwave enemies off your Striker, and into a corner, to be AoEd by an action point = Really good times.

Plus you are the only class in the game (other than Swm with a feat) who can alter their elemental dailies based on the challenges they face.

 

[Nifft]

The controllerness of the wizard doesn't seem to really kick in until higher levels. I found the slow effect didn't help that much (and this was even after we changed slow to mean 2 squares total, not 2 square per move, I don't know how anyone gets any mileage when a monster can still move 4).

Yeah, Ray of Frost is kind of lame. I dropped that power for Thunderwave and never looked back. My Wizard has Magic Missile (for long-range), Illusory Ambush (for de-buff), and Thunderwave (area / close / push). This power selection allows him to attack all three defenses, too, so I can plink away at a Brute's Reflex or hit a Soldier's Will.

IMHO the "controllerness" of a Wizard is evident in his earliest decent Daily power: Flaming Sphere. It is still the biggest gun in my group, and we're 6th level. Nothing else shapes the battlefield as effectively. It's a rolling zone of doom.

Cheers, -- N

 

[DracoSuave]

I found the slow effect didn't help that much (and this was even after we changed slow to mean 2 squares total, not 2 square per move, I don't know how anyone gets any mileage when a monster can still move 4)

If all a monster can do is move 4, then you've negated it's attack, haven't you?

 

[Stalker0]

If all a monster can do is move 4, then you've negated it's attack, haven't you?

No, move 2, charge 2. Most monsters basic attack is pretty good.

I will say my wizard was a wand wizard, so that might be a factor. I didn't find the wand that bad, getting +3 to my attack rolls at key times was certainly useful, probably just not as good as the orb would have been.

One other thing I noticed about being a controller, I always felt at odds with the melee line. My slow and immobilize effects didn't mean much if the meleerers just charged in. But then again, if they don't they don't get to use their attacks, which isn't that much fun for them.

 

[DracoSuave]

To be fair, if your DM is setting up situations where it's big empty room, you one side, enemies on the other, he's doing it wrong. In proper design, there's always obstacles, funnels, difficult terrain, and all sorts of impediments to that sort of encounter. Sure the meleers can charge one or two, but when the enemies have multiple angles of attack, the wizard shines.


But even if that's not the case, you switch up your powers to those that are condusive to your other party members. This is good advice for -any- group member, to be adaptable to tactics that form as you play.

 

[LightPhoenix]

My Wizard has Magic Missile (for long-range), Illusory Ambush (for de-buff), and Thunderwave (area / close / push). This power selection allows him to attack all three defenses, too, so I can plink away at a Brute's Reflex or hit a Soldier's Will.

Same, minus Illusory Ambush, since my character is a Halfling. The range on Magic Missle has been useful on a number of occassions to take out runners or stay away from Brutes. Thunderwave is by far the most useful Wizard spell; I would go so far as to say either the other powers are underpowered or TW overpowered. There's no real reason for a Wizard not to take it. That's doubly true if you allow the Master's Wand from AV (Cast TW as a Close Burst 1) which turns it into a highly useful defensive tool as well.

 

[MadLordOfMilk]

Dunno about Icy Terrain, but I've pushed many foes off of or into things (towers, wells, pits, etc.) with Thunderwave. It's downright amazing.

Cheers, -- N

Yes, but you can do that with any push/pull/slide power. Now, admittedly, at higher levels as a Wizard it'll push a ton of squares, but until then it's nothing too crazy, which is probably why I wasn't seeing it being all that great (y'know, 3 squares versus, say, 8 squares, miiiinor differences like that). Although, either way they get saving throws for getting knocked over edges, but being able to push people into things from SEVERAL squares away is nice.

 

[Stalker0]

Now, admittedly, at higher levels as a Wizard it'll push a ton of squares, but until then it's nothing too crazy, which is probably why I wasn't seeing it being all that great (y'know, 3 squares versus, say, 8 squares, miiiinor differences like that). Although, either way they get saving throws for getting knocked over edges, but being able to push people into things from SEVERAL squares away is nice.

I see the same thing with a lot of magic items too. Many magic items give a +X bonus, where X is the enhancement bonus. At +1, nothing to write about, at +6 its amazing.

 

[Caliban]

Yeah, Ray of Frost is kind of lame. I dropped that power for Thunderwave and never looked back. My Wizard has Magic Missile (for long-range), Illusory Ambush (for de-buff), and Thunderwave (area / close / push). This power selection allows him to attack all three defenses, too, so I can plink away at a Brute's Reflex or hit a Soldier's Will.

IMHO the "controllerness" of a Wizard is evident in his earliest decent Daily power: Flaming Sphere. It is still the biggest gun in my group, and we're 6th level. Nothing else shapes the battlefield as effectively. It's a rolling zone of doom.

Cheers, -- N

I found Ray of Frost useful specifically for Shadowhunter Bats - slowing their Speed to 2 makes their Fly-By attack much less effective when you don't have a lot of ranged people in the party. (I play LFR and these things have shown up in 3 or 4 module so far.)

It's also good against those opponents that are vulnerable to cold, but there have been relatively few of them so far.

 

[Nifft]

Yes, but you can do that with any push/pull/slide power. Now, admittedly, at higher levels as a Wizard it'll push a ton of squares, but until then it's nothing too crazy, which is probably why I wasn't seeing it being all that great (y'know, 3 squares versus, say, 8 squares, miiiinor differences like that). Although, either way they get saving throws for getting knocked over edges, but being able to push people into things from SEVERAL squares away is nice.

Two things:
1/ area attack = more likely to actually push someone somewhere; and
2/ at-will pushing more than one square = more pushy than a Fighter (and brutal in combination with a Fighter).

I found Ray of Frost useful specifically for Shadowhunter Bats - slowing their Speed to 2 makes their Fly-By attack much less effective when you don't have a lot of ranged people in the party. (I play LFR and these things have shown up in 3 or 4 module so far.)

It's also good against those opponents that are vulnerable to cold, but there have been relatively few of them so far.

Sure, Ray of Frost is useful against Skirmishers. It's just that IMHO it's only useful against Skirmishers, and there just aren't enough of those to justify a whole at-will power.

Also, there are exactly zero critters in the MM who are vulnerable to cold. (Well, magma beasts kinda, but not really, since all cold damage does is slow them. Great synergy with your Ray of Frost, eh?)

Cheers, -- N