Maxperson
Morkus from Orkus
Not me. I never really put that together.
D&D 5E Greyhawk: Why We Need Mo' Oerth by 2024
- Thread starter Snarf Zagyg
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Snarf Zagyg
Notorious Liquefactionist
Favorite AD&D and/or B/X Module Covers
This topic came up in a different thread, so I thought I'd start a different thread. For once, this won't be my typical long post. Instead, it's an invitation. What are your favorite module covers from the early TSR era? Rules: List your top 5 (in order to keep it manageable). Explain each...
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Vaalingrade
Legend
Delete everything else you mentioned.
From the setting.
Just make the setting the Sea of Dust. Just a desert with weird magic and bizarre transforming magi and... oh lord, did you just make me care about Dark Sun? Well Greyhawk (hopefully) has way less cannibal halflings and slavery.
Shardstone
Hero
Sea of Dust, alien mountains, and a Demon Empire across the sea — these three things and only these three things would make for a pretty insane take on Greyhawk. Thanks for the idea!
Vaalingrade
Legend
Alien Mountains. Explain please.
LuisCarlos17f
Legend
Saying GH is not necessary because we have got FR is as saying we don't need X-Men because we have the Avengers, or we don't need an action-live serie of Green Arrow because we have got the Batman cartoon.
WotC knows some DMs would rather to use their own homebred settings using elements from previous published settings.
One of the signs of the return of GH should be some actual-play show set in Oerth. Maybe about a reverse isekai, PCs from Oerth visiting and exploring the "Earth" from "Gamma World", or about the arrival of people from far lands, for example the new PC races appeared in 3.5 and 4th Editions.
GH has got not only deities but famous characters, Tasha, Moderkainen and company. What about the novels with the iconic characters from 3.5 Edition?
WotC knows some DMs would rather to use their own homebred settings using elements from previous published settings.
One of the signs of the return of GH should be some actual-play show set in Oerth. Maybe about a reverse isekai, PCs from Oerth visiting and exploring the "Earth" from "Gamma World", or about the arrival of people from far lands, for example the new PC races appeared in 3.5 and 4th Editions.
GH has got not only deities but famous characters, Tasha, Moderkainen and company. What about the novels with the iconic characters from 3.5 Edition?
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Really though, if we want to stress the science fantasy angle, I would think Blackmoor would be a better choice than Greyhawk.
Snarf Zagyg
Notorious Liquefactionist
Eh, that doesn't work well either- partly for IP reasons that might get ... confused.
The other reason is that "Blackmoor" exists within two separate settings - as a place in Greyhawk, and as a period of time (the far past) within Mystara.
Bitbrain
ORC (Open RPG) horde ally
Expedition to the Barrier Peaks writ large, I think.
Azzy
ᚳᚣᚾᛖᚹᚢᛚᚠ
Are the majority of the D&D fan base actually interested in a singular particular setting that already has been published? Why does Greyhawk need to meet these goals that other setting don't. Let WotC do their thing (put in some player facing material and some monsters) and release the setting and let it sink or swim on its own merits. Like they've done with every other setting they've released.
Vaalingrade
Legend
I am disappointed. I was expecting a mountain that appeared from elsewhere.
Then again, I'm better with that instead of Lovecraft runoff #138 like I feared.
That would be Dragon Mountain, completely different setting.
Vaalingrade
Legend
If Greyhawk comes with a label that says 100% No Lovecraft and lives up to that promise, I will buy 10.
Athas has never been around for an edition change. Dark Sun was published for 2e, and discontinued before Wizards bought TSR. A 4e version was made, but that was rebooted to its pre-metaplot version (it might have been post-Freedom!, I can't recall and can't be hedgehogged to check).
It did have its own shakeup in the Revised & Expanded boxed set, which incorporated the metaplot from the Prism Pentad as well as assorted adventures. So instead of seven city-states all ruled by immortal sorcerer-monarchs, the number of remaining sorcerer-monarchs dropped to three and the remaining four cities were ruled by a fledgling democracy, a bloodthirsty priesthood, a triumvirate of merchant houses, and absolute anarchy. I remember that a lot of fans were... less than enthused with this situation, but personally I liked the end result with a setting that's in turmoil and ripe for PCs to actually accomplish things rather than the oppressive nature of the original setting. The process of getting there left something to be desired, however.
theCourier
Adventurer
I actually did have something like that in a DCC setting I was developing. A meteor crashes in a huge inland sea, or lake, and starts altering the biosphere around it. There's a Lankhmar-esque city built on top of ruins from the former city (which was mostly submerged due to the tidal waves from the crash) which tries to keep the alien life contained through the use of a coast guard...
Levistus's_Leviathan
5e Freelancer
I don't have a dog in this race. I'm not a fan of the setting, but I also don't know much about it and don't inherently dislike it. If 2024's revisited campaign setting is between the Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk, I would vote for Greyhawk just due to the fact that it isn't another Forgotten Realms book (which there have been a ton of in D&D 5e).
However, I do have a question. What format would the book use? Would it be one of the half-setting, half-adventure books like Strixhaven and Dragonlance? Or a full setting book with a sample adventure like Eberron, Theros and Ravnica, Ravenloft, and Wildemount? Or the 3-book set like Spelljammer?
Most of Greyhawk's monsters and player races are already in the Monster Manual, right? What would be in the player option section and bestiary? Obviously the lore and gazetteer sections would be pretty easy to fill up, but all of the best setting books in D&D 5e have had a combination of player options, new monsters, magic items, sometimes spells, and all of the lore/infodumps necessary to play in the setting (Eberron, Exandria, Ravenloft, etc). I could see the monsters and player option sections being more difficult than those setting books' equivalents. Maybe statting out Iuz, Mordenkainen, and some of the more popular NPCs?
Any ideas, @Snarf Zagyg or anyone else that is more familiar with the setting than I am?
However, I do have a question. What format would the book use? Would it be one of the half-setting, half-adventure books like Strixhaven and Dragonlance? Or a full setting book with a sample adventure like Eberron, Theros and Ravnica, Ravenloft, and Wildemount? Or the 3-book set like Spelljammer?
Most of Greyhawk's monsters and player races are already in the Monster Manual, right? What would be in the player option section and bestiary? Obviously the lore and gazetteer sections would be pretty easy to fill up, but all of the best setting books in D&D 5e have had a combination of player options, new monsters, magic items, sometimes spells, and all of the lore/infodumps necessary to play in the setting (Eberron, Exandria, Ravenloft, etc). I could see the monsters and player option sections being more difficult than those setting books' equivalents. Maybe statting out Iuz, Mordenkainen, and some of the more popular NPCs?
Any ideas, @Snarf Zagyg or anyone else that is more familiar with the setting than I am?
That would be their best bet IMHO. That, or Ghosts of Saltmarsh II.
I'm not a Greyhawk expert either, but off the top of my head...
- There aren't a ton of unique races in Greyhawk, and the ones that do exist aren't remarkable - beastfolk, for example. There are a few local core race variants they could include, perhaps - a previous UA made an attempt at the grugach elf, for example. (It's decidedly Legacy 5E, however, they'd have to rework it.) They could also use this as an opportunity to give us some not-yet-PC-worthy options like bullywugs, though...
- Can't speak to class and subclass variants, but I bet there are some.
- Greyhawk only has a handful of notable unique monsters IMHO: Suel liches, crystalmists, Greyhawk (steel) dragons, etc. But there are also plenty of Gygaxian creatures yet to be converted from 1E monster books that could easily be included in a Greyhawk bestiary. (They could also update some of the classic monsters converted for Legacy 5E in older 5E adventure modules and include them in the Greyhawk bestiary.)
Parmandur
Book-Friend
I think it would have something to offer in all of those formats.
As a Battle System tie in Adventure...the Setting as presented by Gygax is actually a precarious series of political ticking time bombs (aka, plot hooks for DMs), thst were unfortunately blown up when TSR went mad for metaplot and released the Greyhawk Wars board game. An Adventure were everything goes completely sideways with Iuz (son of Tasha, by the dubs) making his grab for world domination with the players involved in both dungeon shenanigans mass warfare could be brilliant.
An Eberron style book or Spelljammer slipcase would be, IMO, more or less the same thing in regards to content, but the slipcase might have more collectability (big poster map, etc, etc.).
In terms of Monsters...part of what theybwoukd want to lean into is the gnarly, old school pulp stuff that Gygax was so fond of, that was in OD&D and 1E that hasn't made it over to 5E yet, so easily doable in the theme of "weird old fantasy." Tons of stuff in the MM, MM2, and Fiend Folio hasn't made it over, and most of it is weird.
In terms of player content...well, recall that Greyhawk was the default Setting for all of 3.x, and all the options they released were contextualized in Greyhawk as par for the course. So anything, Race or Subclass, they want from 3.x could work. They would have plenty of options for flavorful Backgrounds in the vein of what they are testing now, as well.
What I would say would work for a slipcase, for me: a Setting book that redoes the original Folio Setting material in depth, a weird gonzo monster book, and an Adventure that intros Castle Greyhawk.
Azzy
ᚳᚣᚾᛖᚹᚢᛚᚠ
Player races and subraces are adequately covered, yes. As far as monsters, there's still a lot from 1e and from Greyhawk-specific sources (from throughout the editions) to pull from. From blood golems to Suel liches to Ivid's Demonic Knights to mist wolves to beastmen, etc. There's also no lack of spells and magic items to draw from. I'm sure new backgrounds and feats could be created for a setting book.
LuisCarlos17f
Legend
Greyhawk is more incomplete if we compare with FR, but this also allows more flexibility to add more things, and the world is freer to be altered by the PCs themself. Maybe someone of the twin worlds can be the setting of a wargame, even here the lower level of magic could help to a better power balance.
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