Grognard's First Take On 4e

[Lacyon]

You're not the only one. Personally I think if you got rid of the name and did a "blind test" session a lot of people even those who are in favor of 4e wouldn't know it was D&D. The changes are just that big. It feels more like GURPS without the points mixed with M:TG and I've never been able to like either.

...

 

[Alynnalizza]

Why? What benefit would you possibly gain from being so obtuse and obstinate? Does it satisfy you to feel like you're taking a firm stance on something, even if it means you're being bull-headed, willfully ignorant, and deliberately left behind? Do you thing you achieve some elusive nobility by acting this way?
I only ask because of the bolded comment, which just flatly makes no sense to me. Seriously.. why would you not even give them a read? What would make the books so beneath you?

Beneath the inflammatory comments, there is a legitimate question there.. When an addict is presented with something that is potentially harmful, he should stay away from it.

Seeing as WOTC is going with a subscription based release for fourth edition (Yes I call multiple players handbooks subscription based) there will be alot of time and money needed to invest in the game.

I have an addictive nature. I do it with my art, hockey, and computers in general. I use to do it with D&D and Marvel comics. Much to the detremint to myself and my last marriage.

I would not look at 4E books even if they feel on my lap because I MIGHT like something about it. I don't have enough faith in myself, knowing my addictive nature to material things, especially with a month old baby in the house, to not splurge like I have in the past. So I am being completely close-minded, but at this point I have to.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Seriously.. why would you not even give them a read? What would make the books so beneath you?

Presumably the same thing that motivates some folks to have zero interest in Pathfinder (for example), to leave 3e, adopt 4e, and never look back.

I've seen such sentiments expressed here many times, without such commentary provoking a visceral rebuttal.

 

[Umbran]

this is how I knew this was a troll job

Hello, phil500, welcome to EN World.

You're a bit new around here, so allow me to remind you - we expect a higher standard of civility from folks on these boards than you may be used to elsewhere.

If you think someone is trolling, the appropriate thing to do is to ignore them, or to report the post (using the little exclamation point icon at the bottom of the post). We ask that you not escalate into being confrontational. Please don't do this sort of thing again, thanks.

 

[drjones]

It's efficient, balanced, mostly easily adjudicated. Even the ritual rules are elegant, but the result just doesn't feel like D&D.

Yeah they should add some of the clunky garbage back in to make it feel more old school.

For me dnd feels like sitting around with some guys dicking around and drinking beer. 4e feels just right so far on this point.

RE: the OP: is it just me or does 3.5 seem a little recent for grognardism? What sort of longbeard would ever play such a munchkiney gamist system? not that I care about 3.5 or whatever i just don't want the term to lose any of it's cache.

 

[Fifth Element]

Exactly, but it doesn't make the initial opinion any less 'acceptable'.

Well yes, of course it's acceptable. I don't think anyone's saying the OP's opinion is unacceptable (not sure what that would mean anyway). But that doesn't mean others can't try to help by pointing out that you've formed your opinion without having all the appropriate information.

 

[Alynnalizza]

Well yes, of course it's acceptable. I don't think anyone's saying the OP's opinion is unacceptable (not sure what that would mean anyway). But that doesn't mean others can't try to help by pointing out that you've formed your opinion without having all the appropriate information.

Oh I agree absolutely, and most points are valid. I just really hate seeing people say he's not being open-minded, instead of saying, 'hey, read the PHB when it comes out, you may like more that wasn't presented in that adventure.' Nothing is more off-putting than being told you're not open-minded when you are at least willing to go to the theatre and look at the posters

And I'll say for the record, I hope 4E does well.

 

[Phoenix8008]

Hello all, I'm here to offer my opinion as a grognard who's been playing D&D since before the red Basic boxed set. So I'm a grognard in the time sense, not in the '3.x is the be all-end all and you'll have to pry those books out of my cold, dead, fingers' sense.

I bought KotS Tuesday night and have been reading it since then. Overall, I like what I've seen so far. There have been questions (which have been answered mostly in thanks to those on these boards) and there have been epiphanies as I put together a few important pieces of 4E tech and went "Wow! That's really neat!"

I had expected to like what I saw though, since most of what I've heard about 4E sounded good to me. The production value of the adventure could have been better, but the crunch of it's innards was satisfying. All in all, the reason I think I'll prefer 4E to 3.x is simply a matter of ease. My wife questions why I'm going to buy another whole new set of books when the old ones were good enough when they were new. Especially since it'll be a few years before they have enough books out to match all the options which are available now at the end of 3.x. My answer to her was that I believe I can have more fun playing this new system with less options(for now) than I can with that clunky system with more options.

This is my main reason for leaning towards 4E. It seems to fix what I felt were problems which cropped up due to the nature of the rules in 3.x. Just like I was hopeful towards 3E when reading about it at the end of 2E (when these boards were young and new ). Personally, I can't wait to play the adventure. But I think I'm going to hold off until I get the Core Book giftset that I preordered back in February (when I had tax-return money). Until then, I'll probably run a few combat tests to get more familiar with the rules I have and using the pre-gens for that. Once we have a PHB, we'll make up our own characters and then start into KotS.

So for me, 4E looks great so far, and I look forward to more and to getting to actually play it. For those that still prefer 3E and don't care for the new stuff, that's your perogative.

To each his own...

 

[Blackeagle]

I would compare it more with judging a movie based on the first 20 minutes of it.

More like judging a book based on the Cliff Notes.

 

[Pssthpok]

I would not look at 4E books even if they feel on my lap because I MIGHT like something about it. I don't have enough faith in myself, knowing my addictive nature to material things, especially with a month old baby in the house, to not splurge like I have in the past. So I am being completely close-minded, but at this point I have to.

Well, I'd certainly avoid it then if that's the concern. You might find something you like.

And for the record, I wasn't trying to be 'inflammatory'. I'm glad your line of thinking is rational, reasonable, and not some high-minded grognard aggrandizement of the older edition(s). For what it's worth, I apologize for using the terms 'obtuse' and 'bull-headed'. I knee-jerked a little there, not having the full breadth of your reasoning in front of me.