Guns, D&D, and DDM

[Kae'Yoss]

A gun now and then wouldnt bother me. I use them as the campaign warrants them. Al-Quadim? No. Ravenloft? Sure.

Doesn't the current Ravenloft Campaign Setting feature swords with guns in the hilts you can fire when stabbing them?

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

I have not ever used guns in a D&D game I run. While I can do fantasy with firearms, I don't think D&D is best suited to it.

And I don't use DDM, so that portion of the poll is kinda moot, for me.

That sums it up perfectly for me.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

It would just reduce my incentive to buy more DDM than it already is. I keep getting Warforged in the packs I buy, which are worthless to me, adding more figs I never would use would just make it worse.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

It would just reduce my incentive to buy more DDM than it already is. I keep getting Warforged in the packs I buy, which are worthless to me, adding more figs I never would use would just make it worse.

Well, you're not the only one who has that problem, really: How many axedwarves do we need? Many of us never use Warforged. Kobolds? I personally think we have enough of them for the time being, and things like kobold monks??

Compared to all that, one figure with a gun in 180 figures is ridiculously small. That would be one gunne mini per 3 sets, which would mean one a year. My quota of "useless" minis is far larger than that.

 

[kolikeos]

i love guns in dnd but they should not be the norm, in fact they should be as rare as artifacts, and not renaissance guns either, i want modern or futuristic firearms.
there was one time in my game when a player found a modern rifle, it was pretty cool but its not something i'll do every day.
i like swords too.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

The Score So far

After 170 voters, we have the following scores:

D&D:

12 people called guns their favourite
57 people like the occasional gun-wielder
41 are fairly indifferent about the whole story
40 are against them

To sum it up: 69 (46%) like them to some degree, 41 (27%) are indifferent, 40 (27%) don't like them.

That means only a minority (not even every third) is actually against them in D&D.

DDM:

10 are almost begging for guns guns guns.
35 want them, as long as they are released in moderation
31 don't request them, but wouldn't mind if they were released regardless
37 are flat-out against

summed up, that ends up as 45 (40%) for them to some degree, 31 (27%) indifferent, and 37 (33%) against.

Not quite as much participation (but still a sizable crowd relative to the complete number of voters), and the numbers are closer, but still it's only a third that is actually against it, the rest either flat out wants them (40% - a bit more than those against it) or at least wouldn't mind them.


I must say I'm a bit surprised at the overal acceptance of guns in D&D and DDM. I would have guessed that more people are against them.


Misc:
76 people like swords!

Fighter's fanbase is strong! I'm confident that we'll get swordchucks in one of the sets of 2007!

 

[Kae'Yoss]

i love guns in dnd but they should not be the norm

Couldn't agree more, at least for your average GH/FR-like Fantasy setting (if you're playing swashbucking pirates, it's a different matter). It would make them less interesting.

, in fact they should be as rare as artifacts, and not renaissance guns either, i want modern or futuristic firearms.
there was one time in my game when a player found a modern rifle, it was pretty cool but its not something i'll do every day.

In your standard D&D game, those could probably only be found or brought over by time/space travellers, not manufactured by natives (your renaissance-type musket and pistol are found in the FR already).

In my last campaign (FR), I once took the players for a ride - mainly to show them what else is out there (I think none of them have ever played another D&D setting, at least not for long). First stop was Ravenloft (I went easy on the travel restrictions), the second was the current "beta" of a homebrew I was tinkering with at the time (humans being replaced as standard race, Elements of Magic spell system instead of D&D, other things they didn't get to see) and.... our Earth. Well, not exactly our Earth, but Urban Arcana Earth, with Elements of Magic Mythic Earth thrown in).

In that last part, they encountered a small gang of thugs lead by a drow. The first encounter was with the gangleader's somewhat idiotic smaller brother, who was into Anime-ism.

The second was against a martial artist, a drow gunslinger with 2 Five-seveNs, a brute with a chainsaw and another thug with a browning shotgun.

They won and took the guns as loot.

I didn't let them keep the guns, but they were able to trade them in for a partable hole (nothing to be sneezed at). Of course, they could have said no to the trade, but the Blackstaff isn't used to that kind of answer, and who knows how he would react?

It was quite funny, we all had a good time, and the warlock still has the leather coat and the sunglasses.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Guns exist in my campaign world.

Basically, the arquebus and an arguebus-like pistol, the musket, two types of flintlock pistols, and a longarm designed for taking down ogres.

 

[DreadPirateMurphy]

The thing about a gunne is this: While an experienced wizard will do more damage with his magics, you don't have to be an experienced wizard. You don't have to be a wizard at all! That's why some wizards actually fear gunnes (and gunpowder): They put the power of a wizard into the hands of someone who never learned to wield that kind of power - and the responsibility this sort of power brings.

That's one reason for people to invent, produce, or trade in guns. They're a sort of equilizer. Those magelords might hog the arcane power and forbid the masses to learn it, but with those gunnes the masses could strike back.

The other thing is dislike for magic, or sheer love for invention, devices, crafts, and the like. Take Gond - the Faerûnian God of Craft, Inventions, and the like - for example: He's always eager to prove that his mechanical devices can compete with magic. It was him who, during the Time of Troubles, appeared in Lantan as a gnome and taught his faithful followers the secret of gunpowder. The Lantanese rock gnomes and humans have been making gunnes ever since.
They really won't replace magic, they won't be wide-spread, remaining but a novelty. But they won't go away either.

Well, you might be able to make a campaign-specific case for it, but in most campaigns it seems like being able to use magic is about as respected as being a licensed hairdresser. Anybody with an Int, Wis, or Cha score of 11 or above could be a spellcaster.

As for being the great equalizer...hm, I really don't see how a squad armed with smooth-bore muskets is going to beat a first-level wizard with a scroll of protection from arrows and a wand of magic missile. They certainly aren't going to beat a squad of longbowmen -- and in D&D, anybody with Martial Weapon Proficiency can use a longbow.

As for areas with anti-magic or pro-technology sentiment...well, that's possible (though it falls under campaign-specific). I would want a good reason why a magic-hating area wasn't conquered at some point by a neighbor who was a little more willing to throw fireballs and send iron golems marching into battle. There's a reason why crossbows, dynamite, and machineguns were all adopted despite public condemnation -- do unto others before they can do unto you.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Doesn't the current Ravenloft Campaign Setting feature swords with guns in the hilts you can fire when stabbing them?

I think so. I actually havent bought any of the 3rd edition white wolf stuff. IIRC, in domains of dread, they listed the tech levels of each domain. Nosos, Lamordia, Dementlieu, etc were renaissance, which had flintlocks and such.