Has the wave crested? (Bo9S)

[hong]

Let me also add that I didn't say the maneuver was useful or overpowered, or even medium-powered, simply that it allowed you to do something I don't want ever to happen in my D&D game without good reason.

And like I said, you can already do that in pre-Bo9S D&D. So if it isn't happening in your game, either your players are of like mind and don't do things like whacking holes in adamantine walls for no good reason, or you've banned them from doing it. And both of these can just as easily apply to Bo9S strikes.

 

[hong]

Hong, that won't even break down an iron wall.

Say what? DMG p.60: Iron wall: hardness 10, 90 hp per 10' x 10' section.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Hong, that won't even break down an iron wall.

...a full 20th-level melee type's all-Power Attack full attack won't break an iron wall, but a +100-point damage Strike will cleave an adamantine wall in twain?

Brad

 

[Nepenthe]

There are a number of ways of doing some really insane stuff, like +100 to damage. Has it ever occured to you that maneuver could be used to cut an adamantine wall in half?

No. I was under the impression that maneuvers could only be used against "enemies", and while I've met some offending walls in my day, my emotions have never quite reach enmity. Of course if I'm wrong, I'll just keep house-ruling it that way

I'd rather not deal with, "another full attack.... again, again." Swift actions are relatively easy to deal with; immediate actions, additional move actions, additional standard actions, and additional full actions are more problematic.

But not exactly plentiful, IIRC. You have a point there, though.

Yes, there are guys with longswords in the illustrations. I wasn't mentioning a specific weapon and armor combination because I'm personally attached to that combination, but as something symbolic of the swords-and-sorcery genre.

Ok... But now I have completely no idea why you said it. I'm assuming this somehow deals with ToB not representing the sword and sorcery genre, but I'm just failing to make the connection here.

I've spent a substantial amount of time paging through it. I'm not in the habit of rejecting something without understanding it.

You may have some misconceptions about my misconceptions. It's always dangerous to assume that because someone has different opinions, they are less knowledgeable.

I think I'm about as informed as I'm going to be without spending money on a product I do not believe I want.

Fair enough. And I would like to point out that I was in no way assuming you were less knowledgeable, I was just going on what you were saying - some parts of which I still have trouble connecting to the book.

I'm really trying to understand your point of view here; You're saying that the ToB is somehow outside the conventional Sword and Sorcery genre that "basic" D&D represents?

Cheers,

/N

 

[GlassJaw]

I liked the concept of the Bo9S (per encounter, renewable actions) but found the mechanics lacking and clumsy and balance virtually nonexistent. The flavor wasn't general enough for it to be used in a wide-range of settings either, at least not without significant editing.

 

[Odhanan]

I love the Book of Nine Swords. Great stuff increasing tactical choices for melee characters. A must for people who like tactical D&D like I do. Plus, the flavor's really good. I'm a huge fan of the Crusader, and plan on playing one as soon as the occasion presents itself.

 

[Henry]

Say what? DMG p.60: Iron wall: hardness 10, 90 hp per 10' x 10' section.

Actually, I don't think that either one will break down either an iron wall OR an adamantine wall.

What is the most damage a tricked out 20th level barbarian or warblade do in one hit with NO criticals? I can't see him doing much more than about 40 damage in that one hit, not counting the power attack. (I'm thinking greatsword (12) + 15 for 30 STR, +5 magic weapon, maybe +6 for an energy property like acid, and maybe anot +2 or +3 for those advanced weapon masteries out of PHB2? Any others?)


Now, the strike of perfect clarity, does +100 damage, right? So that's about 140 damage, let's say? Now add in the -20 two-handed power attack, and you get about 80 damage or so? The Warblade with his strike might get through the 10 x 10 iron wall, but I know he's not getting through the adamantine wall...

 

[pawsplay]

Actually, I don't think that either one will break down either an iron wall OR an adamantine wall.

Adamantine has a hardness of 20 and 40 hit points per inch... the same hit points as iron, in other words, with more hardness. So he needs to do 140 points of damage.

+100 damage from maneuver, +40 from Power Attack... provided his weapon does at least one point of damage, a 20th level warblade with any two-handed or one-handed weapon wielded in two hands can easily cut an adamantine wall in half.

 

[pawsplay]

No. I was under the impression that maneuvers could only be used against "enemies", and while I've met some offending walls in my day, my emotions have never quite reach enmity. Of course if I'm wrong, I'll just keep house-ruling it that way
/N

Well, if you insist, the cleric can always animate the wall first, then the warblade can declare his undying hatred and cut the adamantine wall in half.

 

[Nepenthe]

Well, if you insist, the cleric can always animate the wall first, then the warblade can declare his undying hatred and cut the adamantine wall in half.

I am starting to see why it's not a problem in my campaign but it could be in yours.

Regards,

/N