Help, I'm on fire and being eaten by rats!

[AngryPurpleCyclops]

So, what would you do?

I think if it's a viable tactic then letting the pc's do it is a good idea. I might make the pc's stop, drop and roll, consuming their entire turn and leaving them prone. this is a pretty large cost in my eyes (the entire turn and being prone, so getting another save is not unbalancing) If a burning guy jumps in a lake, is the fire out?

Now here's a scratcher:
You get two effects. on eis "You are blinded and are dazed, save ends both"
and the other is "You are deafened and dazed, save ends both"

What happens then?

I would play those as separate saves, the stun is sort of the byproduct of the deafen or blind effect in my mind, so if you're still deaf or still blind you're still stunned.

 

[Obryn]

Do expect a lot of table variation on this one, fwiw

Yep, I had a feeling I was wrong!

I haven't decided whether or not to keep doing it my way, though.

-O

 

[Stormtower]

I'm curious about how ongoing damage and saving throws are treated. I think I know the correct answer to these, but it's worth asking:

1. You've been hit by two identical fire attacks that burn you for 5 dmg (save ends.) How much damage do you take the round before you save? How much damage do you take the round after you save once?

2. You've been hit by a fire attack that burns you for 5 dmg (save ends), and a bleeding attack that damages you for 5 dmg (save ends.) How much damage do you take the round before you save? How much damage do you take the round you make one save, but fail the other?

3. You are hit by two identical immobilize attacks (save ends). You save once. Are you still immobilized?

4. You are hit by an attack that specifies "dazed and 5 ongoing damage (save ends both)." Do you make one save, or two?

Thanks!

My answers below, which match up with others' interpretations:

1. These effects are the same damage type with identical duration, and therefore do not stack. One save ends the ongoing 5 fire damage.

2. At the beginning of your turn, you take 5 physical and 5 fire damage. At the end of your turn, you make saves against both effects separately. If one save succeed, you will take 5 damage at the start of your next turn. This is the same 10/5 interpretation that others have suggested.

3. If the first attack that caused the Immobilized condition is identical to the source that caused the "second" condition, they should not stack, and one save should end "both" effects. Actually I would not allow these to stack unless the attacks that inflicted the condition came from different sources (i.e. different named attacks).

4. No question here; one successful save at the end of the PC's turn ends both conditions.

 

[the Jester]

1. You've been hit by two identical fire attacks that burn you for 5 dmg (save ends.) How much damage do you take the round before you save? How much damage do you take the round after you save once?

2. You've been hit by a fire attack that burns you for 5 dmg (save ends), and a bleeding attack that damages you for 5 dmg (save ends.) How much damage do you take the round before you save? How much damage do you take the round you make one save, but fail the other?

3. You are hit by two identical immobilize attacks (save ends). You save once. Are you still immobilized?

4. You are hit by an attack that specifies "dazed and 5 ongoing damage (save ends both)." Do you make one save, or two?

1. 5, then 0 after you save.

2. 5 fire and 5, uh, bleeding damage. You have to save against each one separately because they are separate effects.

3. No, one save ends the condition.

4. One save; otherwise it would be "dazed (save ends) and ongoing 5 damage (save ends)."

You didn't ask the tough one, though. What if you're hit by something like "ongoing 5 poison (save ends)" and another attack that does "ongoing 5 poison and slowed (save ends both)"?

Worse yet, what if it's "ongoing 10 poison" and "ongoing 5 poison and slowed (save ends both)"?

Corner cases get weird.

 

[Nebulous]

Worse yet, what if it's "ongoing 10 poison" and "ongoing 5 poison and slowed (save ends both)"?

Corner cases get weird.

I'd say if you made the save, you still take 5 poison damage (10-5=5)

 

[Stormtower]

I'd say if you made the save, you still take 5 poison damage (10-5=5)

And you'd still be slowed, unless you then made the save against the single discrete status of "5 ongoing poison + slowed."

Put another way:

Round 1 - PC hit with one effect for 10 ongoing poison, and another effect for 5 ongoing poison + slowed.

Round 2 - Beginning of round, PC takes 10 poison damage and is slowed. End of round, PC saves against 10 ongoing poison, fails save vs. 5 ongoing poison + slowed.

Round 3 - Beginning of round, PC takes 5 poison damage and is slowed. End of round, PC saves vs. 5 ongoing poison + slowed.

Round 4 - No status effects or ongoing damage remain (unless PC is hit again by an attack with a status rider, and the cycle starts over, etc. etc...)

 

[balard]

I know it's wrong, but I like to go by the first answer in the thread. Each effect in unique, and you must save for each, even if they don't stack. This and that same attacks doesn't stack also.

So, if you get "Ongoing 5 Fire", and get it again from the same attack, you still got only one. But if you get "Ongoing 5 Fire" for another, you must save twice to get rid of it.

The principal point is, to me, that save ends is a duration. If you make the save, the duration ends early, but if you fail, it ends later. So, the longest duration wins.

 

[Hawkeye]

I want to know why the fire doesn't kill the rats and solve one problem for you?



Hawkeye

 

[Eldorian]

I want to know why the fire doesn't kill the rats and solve one problem for you?



Hawkeye

Lava rats.

 

[the Jester]

I want to know why the fire doesn't kill the rats and solve one problem for you?

It kills rats; just not enough to help.