Help make a spiked-chain wielding pit-fighter

[Nifft]

I'd like some advice in making a spiked chain wielding pit-fighter.

Level? Race?

Based on your backstory, here's what I'd do:

1) Rog1 -- you got caught stealing.
2) Rog1/Ftr1 -- after three months in the pit, you earned the Chain.
3) Rog1/Ftr2 -- You have been in the pit for nine months, and you've gained some mastery of the Chain.

Specifics:
1) Skills: Max out Tumble, Balance, Bluff, Sense Motive, Move Silently, Hide, Search, Spot, and Listen, if you can. Try to get a rank or two in Gather Info, Disable Device and Open Lock, too.
Feats: Combat Reflexes (and if Human, Combat Expertise)

2) Skills: you get far fewer. Swim (if there are aquatic pit fights), but focus on Climb, Jump, and Intimidate.
Feat: XWP (Spiked Chain)

3) Skills: as above.
Feats: Combat Expertise and Improved Disarm (or, if Human, Improved Disarm and Improved Feint).

Now you're skilled, tumbly, can fight well and do Sneak Attack damage when you Flank. By 7th level, you should have 4 levels of Fighter and 3 levels of Rogue. You'll have Evasion, +2d6 Sneak Attack, Improved Feint, decent skill points, Weapon Specialization, and a BAB only one below what you'd have without the Rogue levels.

-- Nifft

 

[Particle_Man]

Two-weapon fighting is needed to use the chain as doubble weapon so this feat should be taken. I'd go for Iron Will as well, because of your weak will-save.

Could you please point to the page in the book(s) where the spiked chain can be used as a double weapon? I could see a spiked chain designed for a creature one or two sizes smaller than you being used in one hand as one of two weapons (barring the DM outlawing this), but I have never heard of a spiked chain being used in two hands as a double weapon, a la dire flail. Is this new to 3.5?

 

[Tellerve]

I've thought about houseruling something with spiked chain to make it so it was a double weapon when used against anything in the 5' area around you and a reach at the 10', but not both all the time. I'm not so sure if this would work out well mathematically or not, I haven't bothered to run numbers or anything. I was just thinking about the image in my head and also hoping to find a way to reign in the spiked chain a bit.

Tellerve

 

[Kodam]

Master of chains

Its a class feature of the PrC "Master of Chains" in "sword and fist" called "doubble-chain". The MoC is on p.27-28 in that book. And its not BOTH at once. You must decide if you use it as reach weapon OR as doubble-weapon.

Its NOT a main change of 3.5 or something like that. Just to prevent Irritations...

 

[Nifft]

Master of Chains Considered Lame

*bleah* I dislike the Master of Chains PrC. It might be okay for an NPC -- a bad guy, in particular -- but IMHO it's just icky. I'd rather have a "sold-my-soul-to-a-Kyton" Template.

Spiked Chain fighters are generally cool, though.

-- Nifft

 

[Lotus]

since by 3.5 rules you can makes more than one Aoo on the same opponent

You could before, if they took two different actions that provoked AoO's. (I.e., you don't get two AoO's just from movement through your threatened area.) At least that's always how our groups played it.


Anyway. Master of Chains isn't that hot really. Pure fighter, Rogue 3/Fighter, Fighter 4/Rogue would all fit the general category of "spiked chain pit fighter." If you choose one of the roguish builds you might consider the Gladiator PrC in Sword & Fist.

If you're going pure fighter, after you pick up Whirlwind you might consider Weapon Master... though I'd put Combat Reflexes, Improved Disarm and Knockdown at a higher priority than Whirlwind. The ability to hit everyone in a 10' radius is cool but not as useful as making one or two guys suffer a whole lot.

 

[Hypersmurf]

You could before, if they took two different actions that provoked AoO's. (I.e., you don't get two AoO's just from movement through your threatened area.) At least that's always how our groups played it.

It's why you want Hold The Line.

That way, you get an AoO when someone charges into your threatened area... which is a different opportunity to when they charge out of your ten-foot threatened square into your five-foot threatened square.

The text on AoOs specifies that leaving several threatened squares in the course of a single move is only a single opportunity, but the Hold the Line AoO is for Charging into a threatened square.

So when Bob the Orc charges you, you get an AoO when he enters your ten-foot zone, your Readied attack while he's in your ten-foot zone, and an AoO when he exits your ten-foot zone.

-Hyp.

 

[GodPhoenix]

consider Weapon Master... though I'd put Combat Reflexes, Improved Disarm and Knockdown at a higher priority than Whirlwind. The ability to hit everyone in a 10' radius is cool but not as useful as making one or two guys suffer a whole lot.

Yeah, I really like the idea of Improved Disarm, Combat Ref, and Knockdown. What about Expert Tactician?

I like the Fighter/Rogue combo...I also thought of throwing in a level or so of barbarian...the + to str during rage would help disarm.

I'm not familiar with Weapon Master...what are the highlights?

Oh, I also don't know Hold the Line

Thanks for the help so far!

 

[Tellerve]

Kodam, you missed what I'm trying to say. Or maybe not, but if the ability from Master of chains allows the normal reaching spiked chain to sill work in the 5' area then that isn't what i'm going for.

I'm debating having a it either work as a reach weapon normally does (normally ='ing longspear etc) so that you hit things 10' away. Once they are closer you pull the chain in a bit and use it as a double weapon but no longer threaten the 10' area, just the 5'.

Tellerve

 

[Kodam]

I'm debating having a it either work as a reach weapon normally does (normally ='ing longspear etc) so that you hit things 10' away. Once they are closer you pull the chain in a bit and use it as a double weapon but no longer threaten the 10' area, just the 5'.

Tellerve

Ok, then I got you right. And thats exactly what I (try to) say and its the way the "doubble-chain" special-ability works. As far as I understand it anyway.

I just mentioned the MoC as an alternative. Just to give another option. Of course you're right Nifft, he's not a particulary nice guy, but if you don't mind...
You have many of the most interessting feats for your spiked chain-Fighter at this time already. So it makes perfect sense to gain levels in another class. The MoC gains special attack and damage boni, the "doubble-chain" ability mentioned above, always has a wounding chain and some other goodies. I'll admit that he's not uber but I think he's ok.