D&D 5E Here's why we want a Psion class

[Cap'n Kobold]

Something like that could work. It would be cool if there was some part of the mechanics that reflected the inner source of psionics and allowed the character to push themselves to perform at the risk of consequences, ideally on a sliding scale. The harder you push the further you might fall.

I can think of a few options for "pushing" yourself:

1) Risk of gaining exhaustion levels. - I don't like this much as these are almost too meaningful, and would reduce the use of this ability.

2) Burning Hit Dice. You can use a hit dice and roll it alongside your psi dice, taking the higher result.

3) Greater risk: You can choose to roll up to your ability mod (or Con mod perhaps) of extra psi dice, using the highest result of them all. However if any of them roll max, that is going to reduce your psi dice size.
(Perhaps limit the uses of rolling extra dice.)

2 and 3) You can use a hit dice alongside your psi dice, but if either rolls max, that reduces your dice size.

If it functions similarly to 2e or 3e, that's fine. If they are just class abilities like the subclasses just released, that would not be a "full caster."

The two non-caster psionic subclasses focus on fighting/skills, with the psionic abilities just being enablers or boosters of those capabilities. Rather than the psionic abilities/spells being the focus themselves.

 

[Fenris-77]

Doesn't Overchannel do something like that? But with damage instead of exhaustion?

2d12 necrotic per level, rising by a d12 every additional use. Its also to gain max damage on the spell, rather than being able to cast it when you're out of slots. That could certainly be a baseline to measure against though. Something based on a die per 'level' wouldn't be out of sight for the psionics version. That might not have levels at all of course, but it's doable on per ability basis as well.

 

[FlyingChihuahua]

2d12 necrotic per level, rising by a d12 every additional use. Its also to gain max damage on the spell, rather than being able to cast it when you're out of slots. That could certainly be a baseline to measure against though. Something based on a die per 'level' wouldn't be out of sight for the psionics version. That might not have levels at all of course, but it's doable on per ability basis as well.

Maybe some kinda save or you get psychic blowback and take (spell level or equivalent)d(psi dice) in damage?

 

[Fenris-77]

@Cap'n Kobold - I like the suggestions. I do think it would be cool if there was a risk of actual harm. Maybe not on the first attempt, or maybe just tied to higher effect powers.

 

[Fenris-77]

Maybe some kinda save or you get psychic blowback and take (spell level or equivalent)d(psi dice) in damage?

Yeah, pretty much exactly like that if damage was going to be the consequence.

 

[FlyingChihuahua]

Yeah, pretty much exactly like that if damage was going to be the consequence.

Heck, maybe in a later class/subclass feature you get a bonus to the save/resistance to the damage to represent you getting used to your own psychic abilities?

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Maybe some kinda save or you get psychic blowback and take (spell level or equivalent)d(psi dice) in damage?

@Cap'n Kobold - I like the suggestions. I do think it would be cool if there was a risk of actual harm. Maybe not on the first attempt, or maybe just tied to higher effect powers.

I'm not a fan of actual HP damage as a drawback, because that just transfers the onus of sustaining your abilities onto another character. Losing HD is about as close to that as I personally would go.

 

[Fenris-77]

Heck, maybe in a later class/subclass feature you get a bonus to the save/resistance to the damage to represent you getting used to your own psychic abilities?

I think something like this would work well. You could gate a bunch of this sort of thing behind levels.

I'm not a fan of actual HP damage as a drawback, because that just transfers the onus of sustaining your abilities onto another character. Losing HD is about as close to that as I personally would go.

My personal choice would be a bespoke fatigue mechanic for psionics. I'd rather build the consequence mechanic in tandem with the usage mechanic.

 

[FlyingChihuahua]

I'm not a fan of actual HP damage as a drawback, because that just transfers the onus of sustaining your abilities onto another character. Losing HD is about as close to that as I personally would go.

Maybe burning more resources than is necessary?

 

[Chaosmancer]

My creative strength is taking an idea and changing it or adding to it to make it better. I'm not so great at coming up with ideas out of the blue. That's why I keep a lot of my old 2e source materials. The lore in those was so expansive and obscure, that it can provide me with inspiration for decades to come. Probably the rest of my life.

Sure, but you seem to have a strong opinion of what you want. Getting details beyond "full caster" and "No VSM" and "some other powers" would be helpful.

And if we have examples of those powers that we can point to and ask "hey, like this or not like this" is also helpful.

But it could be another type of magic user. A class can have magic abilities that are not "spells." Turn Undead, lay of hands, divine smite, arcane charge, rage, etc. I think it could be more interesting to make a Psion that is all about the class features and not casting spells.

If you are using the term full caster" in place of "full psionic" (or full magic) then it is confusing. Because I don't see what a Psion has to cast "spells" at all.

See, part of the issue with having them not use spells at all, is that many of the abilities people want are already spells. So either we rewrite spells to be the same mechanics with the numbers filed off, or the Psion is missing large chunks of abilities that people think they should have.

Random pick, Calm Emotions. That should be a thing a Psion can do. But it already exists as a spell, and so it would be difficult to make that an ability without just using the spell or copying the spell's effects.

And even if we did, we should still look at the spell, because that gives us the expected powerlevel of the ability.