Hethas' Gambit: Game of Death discussion [rnd 5]

[Number47]

I think you should be happy that seasong has decided your grappling is not a smackdown. Personally, it is so completely overpowering that I expected it to be nerfed.

Seasong, I do not think that walls of force sink. Is Rillos wall of force in the air sinking? It should maintain the level it was invoked at, if there was any air caught in it (how far under the water was he?), he should have pretty much zero chance of drowning if he can swim well enough to tread water. Of course, whatever magic thing was making him float will re-activate, right?

EDIT: Is there an arena-style game on RPOL that uses 3.5 (I gave my 3.0 book away already), but is less than epic level (because I only use the 3 core)?

 

[reapersaurus]

finally ... the boards are up!
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what would you have seasong DO, #47?
Ban my character?
It's a combination of about 7-10 things that contribute to Master/Blaster being effective at killing - I didn't just pay X levels for a "ass-kicking" template, or something.

Is it the monk you object to?
Is it the half-ogre?
Is it the Weretiger?
Is it the AMF?
Is it the cohort?
Is it the Cube of Force?
Is it the feats all had access to, as well?
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seasong - I found out what was 'off'.

Blaster pinned Izad, right?
Then Izad beat Blaster's opposed grapple check.... ONCE.
And escaped.

So Izad should be still grappled with Blaster after his 3rd escape attempt (and wouldn't have gotten out of the AMF, so no extra partial action for the Bead of Force).
That's the scary part about getting pinned.

 

[Number47]

finally ... the boards are up!
---------------------------------------
what would you have seasong DO, #47?
Ban my character?
It's a combination of about 7-10 things that contribute to Master/Blaster being effective at killing - I didn't just pay X levels for a "ass-kicking" template, or something.

Is it the monk you object to?
Is it the half-ogre?
Is it the Weretiger?
Is it the AMF?
Is it the cohort?
Is it the Cube of Force?
Is it the feats all had access to, as well?
----------------------------------------

As you well know, seasong stated that something is a smackdown and due to be nerfed if (a) it is nearly impossible to resist/avoid and (b) it is nearly guaranteed to kill before you can do anything about it. The fact that you are arguing how irresistible your bonuses are actually prove my point. In your AMF, you can probably only miss most characters on a 1 (after all, your strength must be at least 40), inititate a grapple automatically. Once the grapple is initiated, it simply means the opponent is dead the next round (if it takes even that long). That is lot more overpowering than dropping big rocks, and seasong certainly said he was going to nerf that!

 

[seasong]

1) I'm not nerfing Blaster. He was built, fairly carefully, under the spirit of the rules AND the letter of the rules, that I set forth. And it's not a smackdown by my feelings on the matter. There are ways to survive the attack, and a good set of rolls allows things to go either way. This is no more a smackdown than have a spell with a save DC 30 is - it's damned tough to beat, but it can be beaten.

2) Walls of force do not sink, you are correct. Izad is hanging beneath the waves. My bad .

3) I went over this little fight with a fine toothed comb this morning. Here are the changes:

Izad will take more damage from Blaster's two extra natural attacks. Blaster did not miss the initial leap, due to blindfight. It still won't kill Izad, but every point counts, yes?

Izad escaped the pin, but NOT the grapple. I see reapersaurus is also pointing this out .

The upshot of that is this: Izad can still free himself, but he won't have actions left over to break the bead. He would be aware of this, so JDragon, if you want to send me a different set of actions for your post-Pin-escape activity, please do!

-seasong

 

[Jeremy]

He's got a point. I much prefer everyone running from the tiger and the tiger occasionally one-shot'ing his opponents and occasionally the target running away like a scared little girl and drowning himself in a prison of force than:

'Reaper's turn. Weretiger pounce. X is dead.'
'Reaper's turn. Weretiger pounce. Y is dead.'
'Reaper's turn. Weretiger pounce. Z is dead.'

There's no variation and chance for fun things to happen in the above. Yes he kicks butt and in the antimagic field is the most powerful melee combatant, but given enough rolls someone might escape long enough maybe not to fight back but at least show himself a coward and lose points.

Even if you don't kill someone you are still winning the game which is a race of points.

I agree, be happy you didn't get nerfed as a smackdown. None of your one components would be out, but instead the sum of them all, and that would blow. I should know, smackdowns are carefully engineered combinations that work in certain circumstances to bring annihilation.

As Blaster is doing occasionally 200 points of damage in a single round (sometimes at range), that qualifies as a smackdown by the rules of the Sultans of Smack thread. Which is cool, you should definately post him over there when we're done, but it also means you are subject to nerfing as per the rules of the game you read when you joined. So even though the round didn't end in a kill for you, it may yet still if he doesn't have a disintegrate or teleport and you DID get points, and he did not.

Besides even if a ruling didn't go your way (and it looks like seasong is doing everything he can to make rulings fair) I personally feel he is very generous allowing a (Su) ability 'Alternate Form' in an AMF especially when it's from a Magical Disease in an area where all magic is supressed. And even more generous allowing you full attack actions at the end of every charge instead of single attacks as the pounce ability only gives a full attack action at the end of the first round of combat, which we are well past. The magical abilities that I know that one-up that giving it at the end of every charge, are just that, magical, and would have been suppressed. Though it wouldn't be the first time I over looked something.

Also, according to the init breakdown above, your rakes auto hit instead of attacking at your claw attack bonus (which may or not be considered auto-hit by you anyways ) as per normal weretigers.

And apparently seasong is correcting his ruling oversights anyways. So all is good. Be happy. So no need for the:

I guess Blaster's +ALOT grapple bonuses are for naught this Game...

or the

what would you have seasong DO, #47?
Ban my character?

comments. It's all good. Step back, realize you are still doing what you came to do (kill well, quickly, and more often than anyone else) with relative impunity. This stuff is supposed to be fun right?

PS- You know me, none of this stuff is supposed to be offensive or critical. Just poking and pointing out things. Just wanted to say that as I know tone and meaning sometimes gets lost on these boards to the coldness of typeset.

 

[Number47]

Well said.

I do not propose to nerf Blaster. I am warning that if reaper tries to hard to convince seasong that his grapples are inescapable, seasong just might agree with him. Then the nerf stick would come down. In other words, you do NOT want overwhelming success in this game at anything you want to keep on doing.

 

[Jeremy]

Let's get this round over with so we can get on with the killing. I know Cholestus has a new best friend he's anxious to meet.

 

[Pielorinho]

And even more generous allowing you full attack actions at the end of every charge instead of single attacks as the pounce ability only gives a full attack action at the end of the first round of combat, which we are well past. The magical abilities that I know that one-up that giving it at the end of every charge, are just that, magical, and would have been suppressed. Though it wouldn't be the first time I over looked something.

Actually, that's what I'm wondering. It looks like blaster is using 3.5 pounce rules, but I was thinking this is run by 3.0 rules. Am I missing something?

The character is a lot less scary if it can no longer pounce in this combat -- which, by my reading of 3.0 pounce rules, it can't.

Of course, I'm a casual observer, and anyone involved should feel free to tell the peanut gallery to shut up .

Daniel

 

[Number47]

I'm still wondering how he gets so many attacks. I suspect a bad rules call in there somewhere, but I'm not worried about it. I can handle it when it gets down to me and him.

 

[Jeremy]

K. Do you mind if I wait over here in the corner while it's down to you too?