D&D 5E Hit Point Recovery Too Generous

[Tony Vargas]

Does anyone else think hit point recovery through rests is way too generous in this edition? In AD&D a character would get back one hit point a day after what is now termed a long rest. Now, rest an hour and you get to roll a full hit die, rest a few more hours and you get all of your hit points back.

There are multiple classes with Cure..Wounds in the game, and magical healing is indispensable in combat, so you will have one or more in the party. While you could go to the trouble of heading back to town for a long rest, everyone tracking their 1 hp (or whatever you settle on) for that fist night, then getting healed up by the caster and 'resting' again after 12 hrs so he can get his spells back, relatively little is gained from doing so. You waste a little extra time bookkeeping and your PCs are 28 hrs older instead of 24, that's about it. Consider the 'all hps back on long rest' shorthand for rest-cast-rest cycles, unless time pressures demand tracking all the steps.

In the extreme case that all the party's magical healers are gone, the natural rate of healing could finally start to matter - but, at that point the party's probably as good as dead, anyway.

While this is a game of fantasy, some realism is still nice.

Take all the realism you want: Start by banning casters, then elves, then monks... some time after you stop giving characters hps for leveling up, you can start worrying about how long it should take them to recover from being wounded - if they don't die of gangrene, that is.

In a similar vein, it is equally unrealistic that a character gets knocked out, is on death's door, manages to get one hit point back and just springs back into the fight as if nothing terrible just happened.

It's unrealistic that everyone in the party survived early childhood in a medieval setting. Maybe they're just tough/lucky/divinely favored?

I think I'm going to try to come up with something that feels more realistic, without making the players feel like they are being punished. Has anyone come up with a system they like?

There's all sorts of systems out there with charming/gory 'death spiral' wound-tracking systems that you could adapt. For instance, taking any sort of real wound generally entails a reduction in the ability to move quickly or exert physical force or run marathons, so skipping hps and doing damage directly to STR or DEX or CON can work - or INT/WIS/CHA for those 'knocked out' (concussions are no laughing matter).


Sorry if that came off a bit snarky, but, man, have I had this conversation a lot in the last 35 years. And it never makes any more sense no matter how many times I have it. You want your /elf/ who was 'wounded' by a /giant cube of acidic jello/ he mistook for an /animated skeleton/ to heal /realistically/? Unless, of course, a plate-mail-armored cleric of a bronze age pagan deity who uses a mace because the bible contains an obscure injunction against using the /edge/ of a sword, mumbles for 18 seconds and touches him, expending one of the grenade-like 'spells' he /memorized/ that morning, as if he were a magician from the Dying Earth under the sun's red giant phase? Because the only thing 'unrealistic' in all that would be the elf healing too fast?

Dammit, I just got even snarkier.



OK. Real answer:

5e is designed with the assumption that you will change the rules to suit yourself and your players. If you find the default healing rates don't mesh with our vision of your campaign world, or the players' collective visions of their characters or whatever, you are absolutely free to change them however you want. But, if you want to do so in a way that won't have unexpected ripple effects on things like the convenient encounter guidelines, one easy way to do it is to simply re-define the short and long rest.

Since everything - character class abilities, healing, appropriate number of encounters, etc - is more or less in terms of those two time frames, re-defining them can change the pace of the campaign and the rate at which 'natural healing' occurs.

For instance, you could make a short rest overnight, and a long rest a week (or more, if you wanted) of R&R. Thus, you could recover some hps from HD with a night's sleep, but to actually heal would take a week. To be /fully/ recovered (all your HD back), would take a second week, since each long rest only restores half your HD.

With the same number of spells and other rechargeable abilities available between short and long rests, the party can handle the same number of encounters between them, as well. If you do find anything important that does reference days or hours, instead, you should probably translate them to long and short rests, respectively, to keep things on an even keel. For instance, if a magic item says 3/day, instead of 3 chgs, recharges after a long rest, you could 'change' it to 3/week to keep it from being 7x as powerful.

A fairly simple change, and you put your campaign on a more realistic pacing - based on what you consider realistic.

 

[Coredump]

Does anyone else think hit point recovery through rests is way too generous in this edition? In AD&D a character would get back one hit point a day after what is now termed a long rest. Now, rest an hour and you get to roll a full hit die, rest a few more hours and you get all of your hit points back. While this is a game of fantasy, some realism is still nice. AD&D was probably too stingy, but 5E is videogame-like in its ridiculously fast recovery of hit points.

In a similar vein, it is equally unrealistic that a character gets knocked out, is on death's door, manages to get one hit point back and just springs back into the fight as if nothing terrible just happened. Again looking back to AD&D, a character, after being knocked unconscious, needed a full week of rest before being able to undertake any activity. This was likely too strict - but I feel like there should be a happy middle.

Does anyone else have an issue with the absurdly rapid and easy hit point recovery/no negative lingering effects from serious injury in 5E? It might just be me. I'm about to start a new campaign; I think I'm going to try to come up with something that feels more realistic, without making the players feel like they are being punished. Has anyone come up with a system they like?

I agree with you, even as a player I don't like how you can go from 50hp to 3, go to bed, and wake up at 50 again.

And despite the snarky comments, objecting to this doesn't mean you want to spend weeks healing or worrying about dysentery.

Thinking about how to deal with Hit dice: Either going to give 1/2 the normal hp back, or turn a short rest into 8hr.

If you sleep the night, spend the entire day recouperating, and sleep the night again... the next morning you will be at full HP.

 

[SirAntoine]

Does anyone else think hit point recovery through rests is way too generous in this edition? In AD&D a character would get back one hit point a day after what is now termed a long rest. Now, rest an hour and you get to roll a full hit die, rest a few more hours and you get all of your hit points back. While this is a game of fantasy, some realism is still nice. AD&D was probably too stingy, but 5E is videogame-like in its ridiculously fast recovery of hit points.

In a similar vein, it is equally unrealistic that a character gets knocked out, is on death's door, manages to get one hit point back and just springs back into the fight as if nothing terrible just happened. Again looking back to AD&D, a character, after being knocked unconscious, needed a full week of rest before being able to undertake any activity. This was likely too strict - but I feel like there should be a happy middle.

Does anyone else have an issue with the absurdly rapid and easy hit point recovery/no negative lingering effects from serious injury in 5E? It might just be me. I'm about to start a new campaign; I think I'm going to try to come up with something that feels more realistic, without making the players feel like they are being punished. Has anyone come up with a system they like?

I agree with you. I think it's a rule many people would naturally change. I would recommend a number of different options. Maybe healing 1 hit point per day again is best, but healing 1 hit point per day per experience level you have is good, too.

I don't think characters either should just go back to full health or recover from their wounds in the same time regardless how big they were. A fighter who took 50 points of damage should need to recover for longer than a wizard who took 20.

At the same time, if any of your players would feel cheated by this I'd recommend a faster healing rate. Changing the length of the long rest and short rest is not what I have in mind, because that still carries some of the tone of healing just by resting. It should be articulated as recovering slowly over time, as Drizzt once did that I can recall, after a particularly harrowing adventure. He took bedrest for many days.

I'd suggest for fast healing, letting a character recover 1 hit point per day per experience level, plus one quarter of their maximum every day if they have bedrest and they succeed a constitution check with the DC at the same number. Thus, if a character has 60 maximum hit points, and is 6th level, they heal 6 hit points per day + 15 if they meet a DC of 15. The character should also need to have a regular night's sleep to recover the 6 hit points per day automatically. If not, the automatic rate should be reduced to 1 per day or 0 at the DM's discretion.

I think this would be a balanced approach to cover a mixture of players.

 

[Paraxis]

Hit points are ambiguous they represent all kinds of things like luck, skill, fatigue, divine intervention, and yes physical injury. But since you can fight, run, climb, swim, dance, and host a fancy party all at 1 h.p and not be at any penalties obviously the physical injury part is very miniscule until you go down to 0 h.p.

Don't describe each arrow hit, or sneak attack as making things bleed or getting punctured and you should be ok.

Character falls off a cliff lands with 1 h.p left he can climb back up the cliff again no problem. There are no broken bones, sprained ankles, torn ligaments, or other issues in regular D&D. I just find it much easier to think of h.p the way they are supposed to be thought of instead of trying to come up with a bunch of house rules.

 

[Celtavian]

I agree with you. I think it's a rule many people would naturally change. I would recommend a number of different options. Maybe healing 1 hit point per day again is best, but healing 1 hit point per day per experience level you have is good, too.

I don't think characters either should just go back to full health or recover from their wounds in the same time regardless how big they were. A fighter who took 50 points of damage should need to recover for longer than a wizard who took 20.

At the same time, if any of your players would feel cheated by this I'd recommend a faster healing rate. Changing the length of the long rest and short rest is not what I have in mind, because that still carries some of the tone of healing just by resting. It should be articulated as recovering slowly over time, as Drizzt once did that I can recall, after a particularly harrowing adventure. He took bedrest for many days.

I'd suggest for fast healing, letting a character recover 1 hit point per day per experience level, plus one quarter of their maximum every day if they have bedrest and they succeed a constitution check with the DC at the same number. Thus, if a character has 60 maximum hit points, and is 6th level, they heal 6 hit points per day + 15 if they meet a DC of 15. The character should also need to have a regular night's sleep to recover the 6 hit points per day automatically. If not, the automatic rate should be reduced to 1 per day or 0 at the DM's discretion.

I think this would be a balanced approach to cover a mixture of players.

I don't think many would change it. Full hit points means very little in 5E. You can die almost every combat. Hit points is not a status level of your wounds. It is numerical way to simulate a combination of skill, physical resilience, physical endurance, and other factors in combat. Recovering them all doesn't mean you can't die the very next battle to an enemy. I would bet the vast majority find slow hit point recovery cumbersome and lacking. It doesn't do a very good job of simulating fantasy heroes that seem to fight every day and suffer very little from doing so.

 

[PnPgamer]

Thinking that all hit points are actually wounds and bleeding makes them more illogical within the system. If you consider that all those are actually the basic stamina of a character, it all starts to make more sense.

However if your thorn is that it doesnt fit your playstyle and it indeed is too quick, dmg does have the options.

 

[mlund]

13th Age has a better handle on things is that "daily" spells and other powers are all pinned to the "full heal-up" mechanic, which can be adjusted to suit your campaign's pacing. Frankly, this should hold true in D&D as a matter of design if you start to monkey with the time frames for short and extended rests. If "Long Rest" now means a week in civilization then casters aren't recovering their spells every morning anymore either. Likewise the pacing of encounters slides along. 6-8 encounters per adventuring day just means 6-8 encounters between Long Rests.

Marty Lund

 

[GX.Sigma]

Even in old-style D&D, in practice, it only takes 2 days at most (the cleric casts all of his healing spells, rest for the cleric to get his spells back and heal everyone to full, then rest again for the cleric to get his spells back again).

However, I think you'll find what you're looking for in the "rest variants" and "lingering injuries" sections in the Dungeon Master's Guide.

For example, I am considering the following rules for my next campaign:

Every time you drop to 0 hit points, you roll on the death and dismemberment table (instead of the death saves system).
Every time you suffer a critical hit, you roll on the lingering injuries table (instead of the extra damage).
A long rest is a few days in town, and always takes place between sessions. All injuries are healed during a long rest. (Their boss is a god)

I think this makes combat risky, and has lasting consequences, without messing with the actual HP system.

 

[Capn Charlie]

Hit points are best viewed as an abstraction for me, they are plot armor, destiny, or as I prefer "John Mcclane points". A person is a person with a similar amount of capacity to take physical harm, give or take size and pain tolerance. What sets aside our heroes, their allies and their foes, is their ability to withstand rigors that would kill lesser men, and keep going strong. Turning a blow, near misses, dramatic fleshwounds, etc.

A longbow does 1d8 damage, and will generally hit for 5-7 depending on the dexterity of its user, call it an average 6 per hit. A mid level (10) fighter can have 80 odd HP. Does this mean that if we tie him to a log and shoot him with arrows it takes 14 arrows to kill him? Is he some sort of human porcupine?
A spell that heals wounds, that's all well and good, but if HP are an abstraction, and that arrow for 6 damage didn't actually hurt me, why do I need to have a wound magically healed?


Ah, well, yep, good catch. I would posit that long resting to full HP and using hit dice in short rests make more sense than healing magic.

I am starting to look at healing magic, the province of the divine, as being almost as much about divine providence as it is about physical healing, restoring luck and destiny, recovering plot armor, and functionally doing a lot to alleviate stress, soothe pain, strengthen nerve and resolve, and yes heal up a few boo boos, and less about sucking someone's guts back into their abdomen and sealing the wound.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Even in old-style D&D, in practice, it only takes 2 days at most (the cleric casts all of his healing spells, rest for the cleric to get his spells back and heal everyone to full, then rest again for the cleric to get his spells back again).

This is only the case if you have easy access to a cleric. If you don't have one of those, it can take weeks to recover. Which is totally a thing that could happen.

That being said, I agree that Lingering Wounds is probably a good way to represent physical injury in 5E, especially if you decide that Cure Wounds can actually cure wounds.