[Homebrew] The Variant Sorcerer - No spell slots, just metamagic and cantrips.

[Doccit]

http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/S1IF5ma4X

Everyone is always revising the ranger, and while it's clear that the sorcerer isn't weak, according to this survey, people are on average less satisfied playing as sorcerers than they are as rangers. Some people like the PHB sorcerer just fine and that's great! With this class, I've aimed to provide an alternative to the PHB sorcerer for people who love the theme but don't enjoy the mechanics.

What do you guys think? Would you allow this at your table? Does anything seem like a trap option, or too good?

Thanks in advance for the advice!

 

[Otterscrubber]

I would like to see a reworking of sorcerer. I really enjoy 5e in general, but the sorcerer is one of the few areas I felt a bit let down. I enjoyed the difference of a sorcerer in prior editions. Generally it seemed to me they had access to fewer spells overall, but could use the ones they had access to more. Now, even bards have access to the same number of spells and all the caster classes seem to use the same number of spell slots. Not sure metamagic gives it enough of a flair or benefit to keep up with Cleric Domains or Wizard schools though. I've tried to make a sorcerer a few times and basically decided a wizard would be better in almost all cases. I never felt like that with sorcerers in previous editions so something is definitely missing. The wild magic option for sorcerers just seems ridiculous, like The Greatest American Hero of spell casters, not to be feared but mocked..... Sorry, just a complaint without a solution so not super helpful I know but there's my 2 cents.

 

[77IM]

I like this a lot. Some quick feedback:

1. "Arcane Eruption" lol, that sounds funny. I'd also ditch the Cha modifier here since it's largely redundant and VERY powerful. The extra die is enough.

2. "Empower Spell" -- multiplying the Cha mod is a little weird. But I guess it's balanced against people who make multiple attacks.

3. I really, really dislike that there are two subclasses (an Origin and a Path). Nobody else has that. It adds a lot of complexity for little benefit. If I were you, I'd change one or the other into a simple single-level option, similar to the warlock's Pact or the Fighting Style common to many warrior classes.

4. Add some more cantrips! There are some "gaps" in the spell selection for the sorcerer's cantrips (e.g. a ranged lightning attack, or any way to change shape). You can make up some of them with metamagic, but for others, it's probably better to just present a page or two of new cantrips to go along with this new model.

 

[Doccit]

Thanks for the feedback!

I like this a lot. Some quick feedback:

1. "Arcane Eruption" lol, that sounds funny. I'd also ditch the Cha modifier here since it's largely redundant and VERY powerful. The extra die is enough.

Good point. I'll get rid of the cha-mod and maybe up the dice size a little at lower levels. On the name, I'm completely open to suggestions! I thought the idea of a rage-like ability for sorcerers was very thematic but I couldn't come up with any name I really liked.

2. "Empower Spell" -- multiplying the Cha mod is a little weird. But I guess it's balanced against people who make multiple attacks.

Yeah that was exactly the intention. This way it adds exactly as much damage as the warlock's agonizing blast invocation.

3. I really, really dislike that there are two subclasses (an Origin and a Path). Nobody else has that. It adds a lot of complexity for little benefit. If I were you, I'd change one or the other into a simple single-level option, similar to the warlock's Pact or the Fighting Style common to many warrior classes.

That is a smart idea. I just can't decide which subclass should get the pact boon treatment and which should be the full sub-class. On balance, I think it would probably be better to do that to the path, and convert their higher-level abilities into Arcane Arts. How does that sound?

4. Add some more cantrips! There are some "gaps" in the spell selection for the sorcerer's cantrips (e.g. a ranged lightning attack, or any way to change shape). You can make up some of them with metamagic, but for others, it's probably better to just present a page or two of new cantrips to go along with this new model.

I had hoped to be able to do this without adding new cantrips, but I think you're right that if there is going to be a class that depends on them to this degree it would probably be better to fill out the options that are avaliable.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

It seems unnecessarily complicated, much like the Warlock, which is far more complex than any other class. I was hoping for something more straight-forward.

You might be over-constraining your design, by limiting yourself to existing cantrips. As long as nobody else can access it, you can just give them a special class power that does level-appropriate damage, without worrying about how many times you multiply your Charisma modifier.

 

[ClockworkNinja]

During the early playtest there was a version of the dragon sorcerer who would grow claws and scales and turn into a melee character as they expended their spell slots, maybe you could draw some inspiration from that?

 

[77IM]

That is a smart idea. I just can't decide which subclass should get the pact boon treatment and which should be the full sub-class. On balance, I think it would probably be better to do that to the path, and convert their higher-level abilities into Arcane Arts. How does that sound?

That sounds great. I really like the Arts that let you spend sorcery points on particular spells, as it's a good way to allow access to more advanced magic without the burden of a spell list and spells known. I would use the model of how certain warlock Invocations have a particular Pact as their prerequisite. That way the spell selection can be tied to a theme.

 

[bedir than]

The Sorcerer should be a CON class. Their power comes from their bloodline, not their ability to influence others

 

[Quartz]

Eruption Honing seems a little too good. First there's the 120' radius: 30' is the normal. Secondly, adding +1 means that someone could end up with a +4 weapon. So I suggest just making weapons magical and add that armour also becomes magical and somewhat resistant to the three weapon damage types, reducing damage by 3 (q.v. Heavy Armour Master).

Flash-bang also seems a little good. How about allowing a save for the blindness immediately?

Nimbus Spell should cost SPs for the push. Distant Spell should also cost SPs. In fact, all metamagic should cost SPs.

Overall, I'm not sure that the class is going to be fun to play.

 

[5ekyu]

Not a fan of another "cantrips are my thing" caster especially one with so many obvious warlock influences.

While i find the sorcerer to be a little on the "meh" side mechanically (esp with PHB only no XGTE) i would not be wanting to replace it or variant it with even less spell options.

i think the simplest and most direct "target the problem" fix i would do for the sorc would be to provide a "ten spells 1st-5th" additional **known** spells for each origin that work like the cleric's do - they are known and dont count against your known count but cannot be changed out.

A second route might be to give each sub-class one metamagic locked in - additional - but i dislike that because it has the risk of making some "winners" for say the sub-class that get twinned free vs those who get distant free. So, its my least favorite.

I dont think the class needs or benefits from a lot of overhaul and reforming, it just needs a little more of what it does already and a few extra spells known that fit your origin theme seems like the most direct fix i can see.