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You're letting the real world and your own dislike of this use of the insight skill dictate here.
Maybe you missed the part where I said I was being facetious.
You're letting the real world and your own dislike of this use of the insight skill dictate here.
Maybe you missed the part where I said I was being facetious.
I saying it should be the case at all tables.You’re saying this would be the case at your table?
And tossing in this from ElfcrusherThere are lots of ways it can look. From letting me know they look for signs of deceit, like sweating, licking lips, not making eye contact, etc., to telling me that they guide the conversation back on subjects that get those sorts of reactions to learn the person they are talking to. Those sorts of descriptions can help considerably, including auto successes, depending on the NPC in question.
It's not really player knowledge so much as it's roleplaying the situation in more detail and depth. Given the iffyness of skills like insight, it will be hard to get an auto success, but not so hard to get a small bonus to the roll or perhaps advantage. It's not really a way to avoid failure. It just helps reduce the chances of failure.
That is one perspective of gameplay, yes. But for dome, many, that "meta-scope" is not actually what the skill or skill use is about.An Insight check isn't about how a setting's people, organization, motivations and goals relate to each other, but how the DM wants to give players/PC's that information.
To me, it seems each of these is requiring a certain degree of detail in player specificstion of approach and aptitude of the player in the skill naming specific tells in advance, knowing specific tricks to surprise reactions etc" and also even a very specific focus- not just deception but pre-choosing deception about what. Wrong guess on what he is gonna be hiding and what then? Wasted effort and time?
When I compare that to the repeated claims about how nope, player just gives me something of an approach, not requiring player side knowledge etc... and I look at other skills like say arcana, medicine, survival for say foraging or spotting tracks etc or even stealth- it's hard to believe that those skills also require that much "player aptitude in how done."
Does the survivalist have to give you specific types of signs appropriate to the terrain (-and animal) and which type of animal tracks they are looking for or just say "check around for signs or tracks to see what's been by recently""
If I have to tell you "Somethings fishy, let's look for these tells snd bring up such snd such this way and that way" to either get a check or get advsntage or auto-success on a check then it really really seems like player skill in what the GM believes are the actual "tools of the trade" is heavily favored in this flavor of the goal and approach.
Yet, we kinda keep seeing comments saying that's not how it goes, it's not about letting plsyer skill ttump character skill etc.
In the case discussed in the OP, I wouldn't use Passive Insight because, to me, this is a situation in which someone could be actively suspicious about what is going on (because there's a dead body in the alley behind a shop).