D&D 5E How does the Monk perform? (and revisiting monk spells)

[Duan'duliir]

Do you know of a lot of 6th level barbarians with 20s in both Dex and Con (and not Str)?

I hope not.

Any high-rolling* (two 18s high) elf who put their first ASI into Con. Barbs don't have to focus on strength.

*The post I replied to made no mention of point-buy.

Also, yeah, monks are pretty good in almost any situation, while everyone else tends to get stuck with something or other. Especially shadow for stealthy chars and sun soul for ranged combat that doesn't consume resources, while still being good in melee

 

[the Jester]

Monks are great. Along with the rogue, they are probably the most tactically interesting class in 5e. I've got (or had) several IMC; at the moment, spread across a couple of different groups, I have an elemental monk (only 3rd level), an open hander (I wanna say... 8th?) and a shadow monk (now at level 7 IIRC). The elemental monk player is a very unorthodox player, and it wasn't until two sessions of play that the other pcs realized she was a monk (they were guessing bard or druid at first!), so it's hard to judge her. The other two... well, the open hander took the Mobile feat and is the single most tactically apt player/pc I've seen yet. His flurry adds prone/knockback/take away your reactions, so he uses it very well. The shadow monk is a very different personality, and a little more straightforward in open battle, but is often vital for anything involving sneaking/stealth. (The "is silence useless?" thread immediately made me think of her and say, NO!)

 

[Celtavian]

I agree, but I was even conceding the point of the OP, since he was saying a 20 isn't that good!

20 isn't that good, especially once you factor in magic items, spells, and fighting styles. Given the monk tops out at 20 unless he wants to use attunement slots on AC items, it makes it even worse at higher level. Not to mention while the fighter or other classes are getting feats to improve combat ability, the monk has to spend them on ASIs to max out his AC. Though I've found buying the Mobility feat is a more powerful defensive ability than a 20 AC.

 

[collin]

We currently have 2 monks within the group to which I belong (both human, 1 open-hand, 1 elemental, both 4th level). So far, overall I would have to say that as combatants, they have been the most effective at low levels. The rest of the party consists of 4th level dwarf rogue, half-elf warlock, human paladin, and human barbarian. The monks' ability to take multiple attacks/round has been the key, along with they movement and saving throws helping to prevent damage. I am curious to see if this will change as the characters move up in levels.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[GrumpyGamer]

I have limited experience with a shadow monk, but from my experience I would put them in the same class as a bard - a great add on character, but not great in a small group. Darkness and Silence have great utility and really add to the character, as does moving through shadows. Being able to stun opponents is very powerful.

 

[hejtmane]

How do you come out to a 20 AC by 6th level using point buy? Even if you're a wood elf with starting 15s in Dex and Wis, you start with a 17 dex and 16 wisdom. By 8th level you could boost that to a 19 dex and 18 wisdom for an 18 AC. It would take lvl 12 or 16 to get a 20 AC if using point buy. If rolling stats, that's another matter.

Because not every one uses Point By system some of use old school 4d6 drop one you can get hot on rolls plus class bonuses

 

[Chaosmancer]

I've seen two shadow monks (no one ever wants to play Open Hand despite it being the better option IMO)

The first one was killer, good AC, Good Damage and absolutely destroyed if I sent ranged opponents after him. Deflect Arrows is absurdly good. Going off memory it is 1d10+monk level. Best ranged weapon is heavy crossbow and monk beats it by 6th level just by pure numbers. Combine that with their AC, the guy took five shots, 4 missed and the fifth he caught and threw back for more damage than the initial attack (granted it was a shortbow but still).

The other one is going through growing pains, but has the potential to be powerful as well.

 

[Chaosmancer]

20 isn't that good, especially once you factor in magic items, spells, and fighting styles. Given the monk tops out at 20 unless he wants to use attunement slots on AC items, it makes it even worse at higher level. Not to mention while the fighter or other classes are getting feats to improve combat ability, the monk has to spend them on ASIs to max out his AC. Though I've found buying the Mobility feat is a more powerful defensive ability than a 20 AC.

This rings a little false to me. Anybody can grab magic items, Monk could grab amulet's, rings, or bracers of defense to break twenty, or any number of other things to increase their combat abilities. But honestly, excluding magic items we get Fighters at 21 (Full Plate, Shield, Fighting Style), Clerics at 22 (Full Plate, Shield, Shield of Faith) Paladins at 23 (Full Plate, Shield, Fighting Style, Shield of Faith spell) and Barbarians at 24 (Level 20, max Con and Dex, Shield)... And most other classes chilling between 13 and 19. 20 AC is good, not absolute top tier I guess, but saying 20 is not good just... doesn't make sense.

For Example, to get that Fighting Style means skipping out on Archery, Dueling or Great Weapon Master, sacrificing a lot of potential offense. Casting Shield of Faith costs a spell slot and a concentration slot, and the Barbarian has to use just as many ASI's as the Monk to reach their top tier, and hit level 20.

Besides, Wisdom and Dexterity are also great stats for the Monk, that is all their damage and saving throws, which is something they will want to increase anyways that will also naturally increase their armor. Monks lose very little pursuing that AC, no more or less than any other class topping their stats does, and they have so many combat tricks already that even if they took zero feats they are still quite versatile.

 

[Celtavian]

Because not every one uses Point By system some of use old school 4d6 drop one you can get hot on rolls plus class bonuses

So hot rolls to match the heavy armor wearer that buys it and still ends up one better with a fighting style.