D&D 5E How to engage a "poke the bear" player?

[hastur_nz]

The starting point is having some idea of why this person is acting the way they are... as you've known them for 3 years etc, and you don't want to talk about it out loud(?), I guess one should assume they are not doing it to be a jerk, so what is it then? If you can't ask them(?), at least have a good Guess. For example, are they getting frustrated that there's not enough "action"? Or do they just want to play D&D in "mindless mode", where the aim is to kick in the doors, kill everything, and take their stuff? These are possible motives, and understanding the motives will help you find a solution that works for everyone.

I'm currently a fellow player of people who seem to like to pick fights with all manner of NPC's off and on, kill them instead of taking prisoners, etc, and I suspect that for them it's just that they prefer a simple approach where combat is the first option. Running a complex campaign, with lots of NPC's, investigations, and so on, doesn't really engage that style of player, and yes it does lead to frustrations (to me as someone who wants to wrap his brain around complex situations not just kill everyone, and our DM who would like some of his plot hooks to be followed instead of being killed off). As our DM hasn't done anything about it, and the campaign isn't likely to change, I personally dropped my character and created a new one that was a better fit with the others (CN, lol).

If I WAS the DM, and didn't feel a private conversation was best, I'd actually have a group discussion about whether the style of campaign was working out for everyone. I don't think there's much you can do INSIDE the game to fix this behaviour, without it escalating into DM vs PC where DM wins and player gets p-ssed off. It's a meta-issue, where there's obviously a clash of styles, so something needs to change.

 

[ccs]

Ok, since you know the player well, tell us WHY he's doing this.
Then we can give you some ideas.

 

[MNblockhead]

That's a non-answer and completely unhelpful to boot.

How? You want to make communication with your player a last resort. Iserith points out, in my opinion correctly, that this is backwards. You should start with communication. I appreciate you want to engage your players, but maybe he is engaged an his version of fun is to watch the world burn. If that is not your version of fun or fun for other players, you need to know this. Even if he isn't feeling engaged, how do you determine how to engage him further without speaking to him about what is missing?

If you don't want to discuss the issue with him, it is difficult to provide any tips. Without knowing WHY he is poking the bear or if he is amenable to changing his behavior, there is not much point in giving advice.

 

[MNblockhead]

OK, I've made it very clear in my OP that I want to hear about creative suggestions on how to engage a player in game and also made it clear that I'm not interested in "talk the player" responses. I know very well I can talk the player, this is a group that has been together for three years and I know the player well as a friend. I know I can confront him about it if that's necessary, but as I said, I'm looking for in game ways of engaging them.

If you can't respect that, then keep your -posts to yourself.

Okay, the next NPC he pokes is Odin walking the world. Who then gives him an instant free trip to Helheim.

If that's too heavy handed, do as pdegan2814. Have repercussions. This shouldn't be hard to do and should come naturally. If you are playing the NPCs as having somewhat realistic motivations, feelings, and reactions, things are going to come to a head quickly. But maybe that's what he likes. Seem you that other players and you don't like it. You either (1) suck it up and roleplay it out until the other players get upset enough to say something to him, or (2) everyone remains passive aggressive and enjoys their time less or leaves the game. The problem I have with both these options, is that you also end up punishing the other players and it tends to drag on longer than it needs to.

 

[FrogReaver]

I have a player who constantly tries to stir trouble, especially with NPC's. It never used to be an issue as it usually only amounted to him being dismissed by NPC's as annoying, but lately it's gotten to the point where he's actively causing combats to erupt by consistently, and incessantly, provoking NPC's. Some other players are also starting to get a little frustrated by it so it's time to do something about it. My preferred method would be to somehow engage them in a manner that would make the player not want to act like this all the time, rather than simply confronting them and telling them to cut it out. As far as I'm concerned, that's a last resort.

Now, I don't want to focus on answering questions about this player or his PC in particular but rather would just like to get some general advice on how to engage someone like this. How do other people deal with "poke the bear" style of player? How do you get them to do more than just start fights for no reason?

Obviously he finds poking the bear more fun than not poking the bear. You must make not poking the bear be more fun for him than poking the bear. If you cannot do this then you must confront him.

 

[Al2O3]

You don't want to confront the player and say "cut it". Fair. Punishing the PC is likely the bad alternative that will be worse than confrontation.

Constructive versions:
Talk to the player in a friendly manner and ask them what they are looking for when poking the bear. They might have good suggestions.

The other thing is check the DMGs for advice on "instigators" and other player types. I'm not sure what the 5e DMG calls it, but instigator is used in the 4e DMG about "poke the bear" style players. I would happily paraphrase it for you, but I'm away from books until next week.

Sent from my Huawei P10 plus

 

[MiraMels]

If you are unwilling, or unable, to simply talk it out with this player in the hopes of modifying this behavior, just tell them to hit the road. They are already infringing on your other players' fun.

 

[pdegan2814]

OK, I've made it very clear in my OP that I want to hear about creative suggestions on how to engage a player in game and also made it clear that I'm not interested in "talk the player" responses. I know very well I can talk the player, this is a group that has been together for three years and I know the player well as a friend. I know I can confront him about it if that's necessary, but as I said, I'm looking for in game ways of engaging them.

If you can't respect that, then keep your -posts to yourself.

I think you're just confusing people by seemingly avoiding what is almost always the best course of action, talking to the player directly. If you try to correct the behavior solely by making in-game adjustments, one of three things is likely to happen. 1) They might realize the point you're trying to make and knock it off, 2) They'll say "challenge accepted" and double down on the behavior you're trying to discourage, or 3) They'll resent you for dumping all over their fun.

 

[BoldItalic]

If you insist on an in-game "solution", just make attacking NPCs a fatal mistake. For example:

Provide all interesting NPCs with bodyguards. Lots of bodyguards. Word has got around that this PC is a psychopath so people are reacting to the situation by protecting themselves.

This guy has come to the attention of the authorities (or whoever or whatever is powerful locally) and a squad of heavies is following him around just waiting for him to step out of line. As soon as he does, his feet don't touch the ground.

Anyone who isn't surrounded by bodyguards is a polymorphed ancient dragon. Or a 20th level wizard with attitude.

Alternatively, all NPCs are worth negative XP and die of heart attacks at the slightest sign of aggression and where's the fun in that?

 

[MarkB]

What languages does his character speak compared to the other characters? Set your next major adventure arc in an area where nobody speaks Common, and the prevalent language is one that he doesn't speak, but two or more of the rest of the group do.