How to Find an Invisible Character

[kenobi65]

Keep in mind that, even if you are able to use movement to "locate" an invisible character, all you've done is identify which square he's in. He's still invisible, so you still don't know his exact location; thus, your attacks would still suffer a 50% miss chance, because the invisible character still has total concealment.

 

[kenobi65]

The closest way to find an invisible character in such a manner is the "grope about" option indicated in the Invisibility entry in the DMG (i.e., you choose a square or two and grope about, trying to feel if there's anything there. Hit AC 10 and, if there's a creature there, you'll know, and can target it on your next turn).

...and pray that the invisible critter isn't smart enough to move during his turn.

 

[Nail]

...and pray that the invisible critter isn't smart enough to move during his turn.

Or rather: Pray that your companions take advantage of your knowledge before the invisible critter moves.

 

[KarinsDad]

Keep in mind that, even if you are able to use movement to "locate" an invisible character, all you've done is identify which square he's in. He's still invisible, so you still don't know his exact location; thus, your attacks would still suffer a 50% miss chance, because the invisible character still has total concealment.

Of course, but swinging with a 50% miss chance is better than not swinging at all.


The problem came up in our game because after all of the grunts were taken out, the BBEG could not get away invisible because the PCs kept finding him by "bumping into him". There is already a DC 20 Spot check for being within 30 feet of an active invisible character (e.g. one attempting to get away by moving), so with 4 or more PCs getting to roll, it is not that hard to keep track of an invisible character as is. Adding the "insta-find" ability of moving into his square makes it even easier.

 

[kenobi65]

Of course, but swinging with a 50% miss chance is better than not swinging at all.

Absolutely, KD. Just wanted to make sure that folks remembered that the concealment's still there.

 

[Liquidsabre]

Why not just grapple your invisible foe after they're found? If they manage to touch them after the the 50% miss chance for the touch attack of course. Not like you can get a miss chance on grapple checks right?

 

[Klaus]

Do you have a rules quote for this?

OVERRUN
You can attempt an overrun as a standard action taken during your move. (In general, you cannot take a standard action during a move; this is an exception.) With an overrun, you attempt to plow past or over your opponent (and move through his square) as you move. You can only overrun an opponent who is one size category larger than you, the same size, or smaller. You can make only one overrun attempt per round.
If you’re attempting to overrun an opponent, follow these steps.
Step 1: Attack of Opportunity. Since you begin the overrun by moving into the defender’s space, you provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender.
Step 2: Opponent Avoids? The defender has the option to simply avoid you. If he avoids you, he doesn’t suffer any ill effect and you may keep moving (You can always move through a square occupied by someone who lets you by.) The overrun attempt doesn’t count against your actions this round (except for any movement required to enter the opponent’s square). If your opponent doesn’t avoid you, move to Step 3.
Step 3: Opponent Blocks? If your opponent blocks you, make a Strength check opposed by the defender’s Dexterity or Strength check (whichever ability score has the higher modifier). A combatant gets a +4 bonus on the check for every size category he is larger than Medium or a –4 penalty for every size category he is smaller than Medium. The defender gets a +4 bonus on his check if he has more than two legs or is otherwise more stable than a normal humanoid. If you win, you knock the defender prone. If you lose, the defender may immediately react and make a Strength check opposed by your Dexterity or Strength check (including the size modifiers noted above, but no other modifiers) to try to knock you prone.
Step 4: Consequences. If you succeed in knocking your opponent prone, you can continue your movement as normal. If you fail and are knocked prone in turn, you have to move 5 feet back the way you came and fall prone, ending your movement there. If you fail but are not knocked prone, you have to move 5 feet back the way you came, ending your movement there. If that square is occupied, you fall prone in that square.
Improved Overrun: If you have the Improved Overrun feat, your target may not choose to avoid you.
Mounted Overrun (Trample): If you attempt an overrun while mounted, your mount makes the Strength check to determine the success or failure of the overrun attack (and applies its size modifier, rather than yours). If you have the Trample feat and attempt an overrun while mounted, your target may not choose to avoid you, and if you knock your opponent prone with the overrun, your mount may make one hoof attack against your opponent.

Step 2 has the "you can always move through a space whose occupant lets you by"-ruling.
To initiate an Overrun, you must attack a target, since it is pointless to Overrun empty space (unlike Bull Rush, you're just trying to get through, not push your opponent along). If you target a "square", then the square can't avoid you.

 

[Thanee]

(You can always move through a square occupied by someone who lets you by.)

That could certainly be read that way (also makes sense, that you can let someone by, if you want to).

Bye
Thanee

 

[TheGogmagog]

Right, the classification of enemy and allies can get fuzzy sometimes. But if an opponent chooses not to take an attack of opportunity for moving into his square, he can choose to let you through. Simply running around through possible occupied squares won't reveal him. Hence the suggested method mentioned under invisibility in the DMG.

I would also question whether you can stop in an occupied square. At least enough to go back and re-read the circumstance and wording of references to that rule. The rules for not stopping in an occupied square probably assume active combat. There are exeptions, first logic, you can fit four or maybe nine (plane shift might specify that iirc) people in a 5'x5' square. Two people in the same square just can't 'fight effectively' which is usually interpreted as 'at all'.

In the situation you described, searching for the invisible guy. I picture you moving 5' and attacking the square in front of you. Should the invisible guy be in the square you moved into your attack wouldn't be effective.... meaning..... what? you hit him midswing? Doing damage if its a light weapon, but not if it's not a weapon which couldn't be used in a grapple? I do picture a dagger being more effective in this style of search than a twohanded battleaxe. That would be my on the spot ruling, but I don't know if the rules support it.

 

[KarinsDad]

Step 2 has the "you can always move through a space whose occupant lets you by"-ruling.
To initiate an Overrun, you must attack a target, since it is pointless to Overrun empty space (unlike Bull Rush, you're just trying to get through, not push your opponent along). If you target a "square", then the square can't avoid you.

Thanks.