I’m Thinking of Giving 4e Another Shot

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I seem to remember there was a thread on random treasure tables. Upon searching, I
1) didn't find it again.
2) remembered it was about random encounters, not random treasure.
I think some of the ideas might be adaptable, but that's of no use for us now without the thread.

I think the gist of 4E treasure parcels is that if you get lucky, you find an item with a level 5 points higher than you, but on average, you are expected to have the 3 "primary" items (weapon, armor, neck slot item) close around your level. (So you might keep that 5 level item around for several levels before having another lucky find.)

If your random treasure tables capture that, you should be fine. As long as you stay in the 5 level range around the characters level, it shouldn't become grossly unbalanced.

 

[Stalker0]

As far as treasure goes, you might consider a common houserule:

At 1st level, and every 5 levels after (so 6th, 11th, etc), you gain a +1 enhancement bonus to attack rolls, damage rolls, and all defenses.

I think there is also a secondary AC bonus for heavy armor users, if anyone wants to chip in.

The idea here is to give the player's the "required" bonuses from magic items. Once that's done, magic items are completely optional, and you can give them out however you want, whenever you want, and you shouldn't see any major issues with your party.

 

[Mournblade94]

It's simple... The DC is equal to the appropriate defense of the enemy you are trying to affect.

So, for example:

"I want to punch the enemy hard in the gut and knock the wind out of him!"
Strength attack (or perhaps Athletics) vs. Fortitude; a hit dazes the target until the end of your next turn.

As opposed to:

"I want to dazzle and confuse the enemy with a whirling display of brilliant swordsmanship!"
Dexterity attack (or perhaps Thievery or Acrobatics) vs. Will; a hit dazes the target until the end of your next turn.

The difference between stunts like this and powers is that you want to make certain that the powers are generally dealing more damage and have effects that last longer.

I don't see how this particular case requires 4e skill challenge rule set. The same can be done (and I have ran skill challenges) with 3rd edition rules. It was done all the time in Mutants and Masterminds.

 

[Piratecat]

I don't see how this particular case requires 4e skill challenge rule set. The same can be done (and I have ran skill challenges) with 3rd edition rules. It was done all the time in Mutants and Masterminds.

This post refers to (p. 42 DMG) stunts, not skill challenges. Skill challenge DCs can be found at the errata - err, update page for the DMG linked up-thread. I highly recommend you listen to the skill challenge podcast also previously linked, because they talk a lot about how to modify the numbers on the fly.

 

[Mournblade94]

This post refers to (p. 42 DMG) stunts, not skill challenges. Skill challenge DCs can be found at the errata - err, update page for the DMG linked up-thread. I highly recommend you listen to the skill challenge podcast also previously linked, because they talk a lot about how to modify the numbers on the fly.

Right.

Many thanks!

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I don't see how this particular case requires 4e skill challenge rule set. The same can be done (and I have ran skill challenges) with 3rd edition rules. It was done all the time in Mutants and Masterminds.

Note that these are not the skill challenge rule set, but the guidelines for stunts.

It requires the 4E rules set because the ruleset doesn't just provide some random DCs, but also suggested damage values that are "balanced" for that level.

It wouldn't make sense to be transplant it 1:1 to M&M or 3rd Edition, since they have different assumptions on damage per round, difficulty of tasks and the action economy.

Asking why you need them is a little as if you ask "Why do I need 4E hit points? I ran with hit points in Warhammer and AD&D, too!"

PS: Well, ninjaed by Piratecat and Mournblade94 himself.

 

[Mournblade94]

Note that these are not the skill challenge rule set, but the guidelines for stunts.

It requires the 4E rules set because the ruleset doesn't just provide some random DCs, but also suggested damage values that are "balanced" for that level.

It wouldn't make sense to be transplant it 1:1 to M&M or 3rd Edition, since they have different assumptions on damage per round, difficulty of tasks and the action economy.

Asking why you need them is a little as if you ask "Why do I need 4E hit points? I ran with hit points in Warhammer and AD&D, too!"

PS: Well, ninjaed by Piratecat and Mournblade94 himself.

Right. I was under the assumption that this was the skill challenge part. I used skill challenges alot when I was running 4e, but they were not too different than how I ran them in 3rd edition.

Yes this case is not what I thought it was.

 

[RodneyThompson]

But your barbarian example is pretty much precisely the wrong example to use when trying to compare 3e daily-type powers with 4e. The barbarian rage is simply exhausting. There are only so many times you go balls-to-the-wall a day without getting some serious rest. Heck, it even comes with some short term fatigue right when you come out of the rage. In other words, rage comes with a respectable rationale built into it.

With all due respect, I don't think the rationale is all that different at all. A daily power can represent a maneuver that requires the perfect unison of physical prowess and mental focus to pull off, something that wears not only on your body but on your nerves as well. It may not exhaust you, but it does require an expenditure of effort and relies on your training and mental acuity as well.

If you want a better analog, look at some of the higher level rogue abilities that are a limited number of times per day.

Certainly they would also make a good analogue. I would still be very interested to hear the OP's answer to the question.

 

[Dire Bare]

I do play, and like, 4e. But Samuel Leming didn't enjoy it the four times he tried, and a fifth attempt seems quixotic. Why not play the C&C and Pathfinder Samuel mentions in his signature, or the many other old school games that fit his playstyle.?

Sorry to ascribe motives to your post. Knee-jerk reaction.

I've played a number of games I didn't quite get the first couple of times, but my friends were having so much fun I'd give it another shot. Some of these games I never did grok, with others I had an epiphiny and grew to love them. Axis & Allies is one, first five or six times I played it I really didn't care for it. But my pal who breathes A&A kept at it, and now it is one of my favorite board games. I'm the same way with the World of Warcraft MMO and the Mutants & Masterminds RPG. Heroclix I never grew to love the game, but I collected the figures for supers roleplaying!

 

[Logan_Bonner]

The flumphs are listed as unaligned rather then lawful good? Feh. It's the April Fools adventure and they've somehow managed to miss out on over half the joke. Pseudo-flumphs!

Most flumphs are lawful good. These are specific flumphs who've been hanging around with a bad element.