D&D 4E I admit it. I don't "get" 4e psionics.

[cignus_pfaccari]

Quick question... I'm sure this is answered somewhere, but I can't find where. If you're playing a human and choose ardent, psion or battlemind, how is your extra at-will treated? Is it still augmentable? If so, seems like humans would be the go-to races for these classes, even if only because spamming four powers is slightly less boring than spamming three.

Look in the back in the definition of Augmentation.

Basically, the human or half-elf bonus at-wills lose augmentation abilities and keywords.

On the one hand, this seems to suck, because an augmentable bonus at-will would make psion/ardent/battlemind less boring, as you'd increase your # of powers by 33%.

On the other hand, that would mean humans would become THE psionic race, and that would suck. Also, that's kind of powerful to get an at-will and an encounter (effectively) off of one racial feature.

Brad

 

[Destil]

Well, the battlemind actually has the most reasons to upgrade: Lightning Rush (7), Brutal Barrage (13), Might of the Ogre (23), and Mind of Mirrors at 27 all beat the pants off level 1 at-wills, mostly because they address your (almost) complete lack of stickiness.

I was actually thinking of Luring Steel(13)->Cage of Cowardice(28). Steel's flat out better unaugmented.

From what I've seen battleminds are plenty sticky, but they stick to the target rather than the other way around. DM's who abuse shift-charge a LOT are overly metagaming, there's plenty of ways a DM can screw a player.

Perhaps the at-will issue is that at-wills are intended to give you a general basic class ability. Needing to make so many and so many variants could be the issue. It would have been better, perhaps, if the classes got some class features that functioned like at-wills. Like the battle mind can choose something like 'Whenever you attack a target with an unaugmented at-will you mark them' or a few other choices. Then the basic un-augmented at will can be very simple and have minimal power, and then you don't worry about losing a key option when you switch...

 

[ravenheart]

I kinda wish they'd taken a different option. You get power points still, and the 1st level at-wills can be augmented, but instead of replacing encounter powers with higher level at-will powers, you'd get additional augments that you could add to any power.

So like, ardents can Demoralize, Energize, Focus, or Ire. When you use one of those, you can spend power points to enhance it. Or you can spend power points to activate a higher level augment, which is not a power of its own, just a rider.

Maybe these could include utility things like "ally gets a save" or "ally gets resist 5 [energy type]," or attacks like "any other enemy adjacent to the target takes 5 damage (save ends)" or "the target experiences a moment of recent history; one ally chooses an expended encounter power and uses it on the creature." Or maybe you'd conjure a minion of ectoplasm, or link the local area to the far realm, letting you adjust the terrain, though that's more controller-y than leader-y. Obviously they'd spend more than 5 minutes coming up with the idea.

You'd end up with flexible hodgepodge powers. Sort of like how full style monk powers let you mix up nifty moves and attacks, this would let you mix up core powers and rider effects.

This.

Or at least some variation of this, which seems like a clear improvement in regards to the current system.

They could have kept the encounter system partially intact aswell by going this way; encounter augments (which is what they are, technically) to at-will powers, costing power points (based on level).
This way one could still keep the lower augments (as long as they're balanced; maybe even allow them to stack with encounter augments?), otherwise there'd be little point to the power point mechanic.

 

[Obryn]

As one idea to (partially) fix psionics, you could standardize PP costs for all powers. Everything has an Augment 1 and an Augment 2. Then, dramatically reduce the power point pool. Say, to 6 starting at 7th level (or 8 with a psionic PP). This keeps high-level augments relevant and attractive; they no longer need to be twice as good as the heroic-level augments in order to work.

AFAIC, there's no reason for high-level augments to be more expensive. You've paid your dues by getting to that level in the first place.

-O

 

[Destil]

As one idea to (partially) fix psionics, you could standardize PP costs for all powers. Everything has an Augment 1 and an Augment 2. Then, dramatically reduce the power point pool. Say, to 6 starting at 7th level (or 8 with a psionic PP). This keeps high-level augments relevant and attractive; they no longer need to be twice as good as the heroic-level augments in order to work.

AFAIC, there's no reason for high-level augments to be more expensive. You've paid your dues by getting to that level in the first place.

-O

That's like letting a non-psion swap out every power they have, though. Like a rogue could have 3 level 7 encounters at 7th ...

 

[Obryn]

That's like letting a non-psion swap out every power they have, though. Like a rogue could have 3 level 7 encounters at 7th ...

Good point!

I'm not sure how huge a deal that'd be, given how iffy a lot of the big augments are. But yeah, this is true.

-O

 

[Samurai]

Good point!

I'm not sure how huge a deal that'd be, given how iffy a lot of the big augments are. But yeah, this is true.

-O

I agree, the higher level augments really aren't all that much better in most cases, and don't really keep up with other classes Enc power progression.