I don't get the dislike of healing surges

Long-term wound healing is boring and tedious, which is why they removed it in 4e, I imagine. You lose the narrative of lying in bed for 6 weeks (wow, can't wait to roleplay that!) in exchange for gaining the narrative of taking a sucking chest wound at 4 in the afternoon and still being able to rescue the princess by midnight, when her soul would be sucked out by the evil sorcerer using a diabolic ritual. With long-term wound healing, your only choice is to ransom the dried husk of a corpse so her family can bury it properly. Oh, but there's always magic, magic trumps everything, which is a major failure of 3e, IMO. But that's another thread.

I think this is all a matter of taste and both sides are entitled to their point of view. I can see how some groups don't like being sidelined for a week to deal with the sucking chest wound. On the other hand for me (both as a player and GM) that always made more narrative sense and since I like urban adventure with very little combat I would still have a cool time even with a character recovering like that (though in most settings access to magic means you won't be sitting it out for a week).

But for me taking a sucking chest wound at 4pm and then being able to rescue the princess that night without access to magical healing really disrupts my suspension of disbelief.
 

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Long-term wound healing is boring and tedious, which is why they removed it in 4e, I imagine. You lose the narrative of lying in bed for 6 weeks (wow, can't wait to roleplay that!) in exchange for gaining the narrative of taking a sucking chest wound at 4 in the afternoon and still being able to rescue the princess by midnight, when her soul would be sucked out by the evil sorcerer using a diabolic ritual. With long-term wound healing, your only choice is to ransom the dried husk of a corpse so her family can bury it properly. Oh, but there's always magic, magic trumps everything, which is a major failure of 3e, IMO. But that's another thread.
Well, I like the narrative options of:

(1) Taking the chest wound and dying. End of story for this character, but potentially very interesting to the other PCs, or your new character. This narrative might send your party into a revenge-driven rage, it might make them rethink every decision they made that led up to this, it might make them more cautious, or it might make them more reckless. The narratives are varied and interesting.

(2) Taking the chest wound and having to spend days or a couple weeks recovering (if you have no way to heal near you). This lets the setting evolve, and opens up narratives you wouldn't see if not for time spent recovering. For example, the princess dying might be a very interesting narrative to explore, since I assume she was killed for a reason. Non-death failures are very interesting much of the time.

(3) Taking the chest wound and not even slowing down. That is, it's not very much HP damage, and you push past it, or recover it overnight. This, too, opens up the narrative of being wounded but continuing to save the princess, which can open up some really interesting narratives that aren't able to be explored without this option.

I think there's a lot of interesting stories to be told in a system that allows all three. Number (2), however, is something I don't want to go without. I love things that give the setting time to evolve. That is, I don't like long distance teleports or plane shifting being a common option for the PCs or the setting (something 3.X failed hard at).

Having to hoof it everywhere gives the setting time to change naturally, which can really propel story forward. My 3.X game only got hard to run once transportation magic became common to the PCs and the setting (the setting couldn't use magic for a while for story reasons). It was hard for anything to build up without it getting beaten down before really getting off the ground (divination was another huge culprit here, and it really failed me in 3.X as well).

At any rate, it's not the "you're bedridden for a week!" that's interesting, which is why it usually gets skimmed over pretty quickly. It's what happens with the setting in that time that's really interesting. And that's why I want long term wounds in my game. But, as always, play what you like :)
 

You guys sound like DMs. ;) Most players I know don't like long periods where they're out of the action, or losing characters. There are a few hard-core roleplayers that get into that kind of thing, and some that don't get attached to their characters too much. But most players want to be kicking ass and taking names, not dying or nursing wounds for any length of time.

I think the reason most players don't get into the drama of near-death experiences is that in stories, you always kinda know in the back of your mind that the hero will survive to fight another day (unless you're reading George R. R. Martin). But at the table, the risk of losing a beloved character for good, or even getting out of the action for a significant amount of time, is a downer to most players. At least in my experience. YMMV, agree to disagree, etc.
 

You guys sound like DMs. ;) Most players I know don't like long periods where they're out of the action, or losing characters. There are a few hard-core roleplayers that get into that kind of thing, and some that don't get attached to their characters too much. But most players want to be kicking ass and taking names, not dying or nursing wounds for any length of time.
I am indeed a long term GM, and rarely do I get the opportunity to play. So, good call :)

Yes, I figure most players won't like getting taken out of the action. Then again, most players don't like dying or losing, but I personally wouldn't want to run or play in a game where that's not a real option (not that you're saying that should be the case). My players and I just like a little more in the way of narrative paths available through wounds. Really, it's just a means to an end. We like mechanics that support the setting advancing, so that also means limiting things like teleportation, etc.

I think the reason most players don't get into the drama of near-death experiences is that in stories, you always kinda know in the back of your mind that the hero will survive to fight another day (unless you're reading George R. R. Martin). But at the table, the risk of losing a beloved character for good, or even getting out of the action for a significant amount of time, is a downer to most players. At least in my experience. YMMV, agree to disagree, etc.
Yep, our mileage has varied, but I think I'm in the minority. My players have lost a good number of characters over the years, but they're still into their characters. We play for immersion, so we really get into the game, and the character deaths usually serve to further the immersion, rather than pull people away. But, as I said, that's probably abnormal :)

So, I think you're right, many players (probably most) don't like losing characters, or failing the quest, or what have you. We do, but we're weird. As always, play what you like :)
 

I would argue that most players are far more inclined to be okay with losing the character than having their character sidelined for significant periods of time. If you lost the character, you can promote an NPC and be playing again in a matter of moments. Or parachute a new PC into the story, or whatever works for you. IOW, you can add in a new character as soon as you make one.

If you character is sidelined for a month, unless the entire party decides that they will sit by your bed and hold your hand, you get to ride the pines and watch the game for however long it takes to roleplay through the next extended period of time.

I don't play RPG's to sit and watch for three hours. No offense to the other people at the table, but watching D&D for 3 hours is not my idea of fun.

And I pick 3 hours specifically because I've actually HAD DM's who did this. Character gets sidelined, but not killed, and play continues. FOR AN ENTIRE SESSION. Did it once, will never, ever do it again.
 

And I pick 3 hours specifically because I've actually HAD DM's who did this. Character gets sidelined, but not killed, and play continues. FOR AN ENTIRE SESSION. Did it once, will never, ever do it again.

Well, that's bad DMing- I'd have had you helping me run NPCs and critters, since many hands make light work. (And it feels so naughty!)
 


I would argue that most players are far more inclined to be okay with losing the character than having their character sidelined for significant periods of time. If you lost the character, you can promote an NPC and be playing again in a matter of moments. Or parachute a new PC into the story, or whatever works for you. IOW, you can add in a new character as soon as you make one.

If you character is sidelined for a month, unless the entire party decides that they will sit by your bed and hold your hand, you get to ride the pines and watch the game for however long it takes to roleplay through the next extended period of time.

I don't play RPG's to sit and watch for three hours. No offense to the other people at the table, but watching D&D for 3 hours is not my idea of fun.

And I pick 3 hours specifically because I've actually HAD DM's who did this. Character gets sidelined, but not killed, and play continues. FOR AN ENTIRE SESSION. Did it once, will never, ever do it again.
Ha, my players willingly put themselves into these situations each week. I have one player who has actively gone with the other players one out of five sessions so far, and he stays at the castle when they go out most of the time, by choice. I've encouraged him to go out, or to swap characters, but he says he's happy to give talk when they're at the castle, give advice when they're not, and just stay at home and craft amazing objects the rest of the time. He does want to start a court in the castle, though.

Again, though, I think this group is in the minority. They're okay with these things, and I think that's abnormal, but I'm okay with it. I'm not surprised that people wouldn't want to get sidelined for a long time. As always, play what you like :)
 

Ha, my players willingly put themselves into these situations each week. I have one player who has actively gone with the other players one out of five sessions so far, and he stays at the castle when they go out most of the time, by choice. I've encouraged him to go out, or to swap characters, but he says he's happy to give talk when they're at the castle, give advice when they're not, and just stay at home and craft amazing objects the rest of the time. He does want to start a court in the castle, though.

Again, though, I think this group is in the minority. They're okay with these things, and I think that's abnormal, but I'm okay with it. I'm not surprised that people wouldn't want to get sidelined for a long time. As always, play what you like :)
I think it's notable here that how a player reacts to such a situation is often quite different when he puts himself into it knowingly and willingly, rather than at the hands of the party, the Dm, or the dice.
 


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