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Pathfinder 1E I get the feeling Paizo isn't worried about Wizards of the Coast.

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
Seems to me that the people who are really worried are those people who keep creating threads on ENWorld about all the problems they have with D&DNext and how they think it's not going to work, and how much Pathfinder is better. Almost as if they need to justify their decision to not play it by continually trying to run it down and the company that produces it. ;)
 

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ForeverSlayer

Banned
Banned
I think you're half right. I agree that Paizo don't appear at all worried about WotC. However, WotC have been very clear that they're not worried about Paizo either, and I see no reason to doubt them.

One key thing to remember is that the two companies are in almost completely different worlds - Paizo's concern is, primarily, about selling subscriptions to Adventure Paths; WotC's is about selling the D&D brand as a whole, of which the D&D TTRPG is only a tiny part.

I don't fully believe WoTc aren't worried about Paizo because that could possibly be a ton of customers they don't have. Also, Paizo is steadily growing and taking over the market at a slow but increasing rate. I think they are becoming a force to watch out for.

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ForeverSlayer

Banned
Banned
Seems to me that the people who are really worried are those people who keep creating threads on ENWorld about all the problems they have with D&DNext and how they think it's not going to work, and how much Pathfinder is better. Almost as if they need to justify their decision to not play it by continually trying to run it down and the company that produces it. ;)

Well in all honesty, I have been expecting more out of D&D and WoTc than what they have delivered. They aren't anyone's best buddy, they are a company that takes our money and gives us something in return. In my opinion, we are on a second edition in a row that I find lackluster and this is an internet forum where we discuss all sorts of RPG related topics, so I want to voice my displeasure.
 

I hope both companies do well, and think both can succeed in their own way, but i do not thini paizo would announce it if they were worried. Personally, I think any company that succesful should be concerned when a major competitor plans a new edition. Both WoTC and Paizo should be concerned about the other.
 

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
In my opinion, we are on a second edition in a row that I find lackluster and this is an internet forum where we discuss all sorts of RPG related topics, so I want to voice my displeasure.

We know. We've gotten it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. #dothprotesttoomuch

Heh heh.
 


delericho

Legend
I don't fully believe WoTc aren't worried about Paizo because that could possibly be a ton of cuatomers that they don't have. Also, Paizo is steadily growing and taking over the market at a slow but increasing rate. I think Paizo is becoming a force to watch out for.

D&D has much more to fear from Hasbro than it ever will from Paizo. Not because the owners of WotC are necessarily malicious in any sense, but just because they're so big and D&D so small - Hasbro could crush D&D underfoot in a casual reorganisation and completely fail to notice.
 

knottyprof

First Post
It would be nice if the next version of the game was somewhat compatible with Pathfinder and vice versa. Biggest issue I see (as a part time tiny self publisher) is that of licensing with WotC. I love the OGL and if they can bring that back or something quite similar so that us small timers can produce supplements without having to pay royalties or send in a permission slip before attempting to develop or produce a product. I think that is one of the biggest draws for Pathfinder over the other game, besides the Paizo products, there is a huge base and growing of 3rd party products out there for general consumption.
 

Warbringer

Explorer
Well I have been a customer since 1985 and I really hate to sit out two editions in a row.

*shrugs*

You found an edition that works for you, nothing wrong with that.

I think WoTC corporate looks at Paizo and sees a $10MM a year publisher and *shrugs*... Come 5th they will do that the first month or so... And that's just the books, they will turn D&D brand into a q$100-200MM tarrasque .. A good movie alone will generate that alone, and the have the capital to make it work..

I think the employees at WoTC look at Paizo and think wouldn't that be cool to be there, or somewhere similar ...
 

Mercurius

Legend
I think the premise is a bit off, which is that Pathfinder and D&D 5e are mutually exclusive - not just the purchasing of products, but the usefulness across games. Enterprising DMs use material from a wide variety of sources, including different editions of the same game. I would think that if 5e turns out to be what they intended from the get-go, adapting Pathfinder material for a 5e game will be relatively easy.

Tabletop gaming is not only a hobby of play, but for quite a few, also a hobby of collecting. Not to mention that many gamers cross-pollinate with different games, especially different versions of the same game. And yes, there are folks who buy both Paizo and WotC product, and use both in their D&D game.

I'll use myself as an example. I played 3e until 2003, when I took a five-year or so hiatus from active playing and didn't start up again until 2008, after 4e came out. I played 4e for about four years and haven't played in almost a year, but am starting up a 5e campaign in January. I don't play Pathfinder because it is too much like 3.5e, and I prefer a simpler game, and one not so focused on system mastery. That said, I buy Pathfinder products selectively - mainly Golarion setting books, but also a few adventure paths and hardcovers - because a) I like Paizo and think they make a great product, b) I enjoy collecting setting books and Golarion is the most in-depth ongoing setting in the biz right now, and c) I want to mine their products for ideas for my own campaign, even considering adapting Runelords or Shattered Star for my 5e campaign.

The larger issue, though, is the almost jingoistic nationalism that is exhibited in your post, ForeverSlayer - as if we have to pick sides, and as if there is some kind of merit or pay-off in actively trying to put WotC down and turn people away from 5e. This is akin to trying to win the battle without any awareness about the larger war. The battle is WotC vs. Paizo; the war is the health of the hobby, in paticular D&D. I'm guessing (or hoping) that the folks at WotC and Paizo realize that the battle actually negatively impacts the war, and thus both are rooting for each other.

I realize that there are a few embittered folks who will hate anything WotC comes out with, but I'm fairly certain that the majority of gamers will at least give 5e a look, and are interested in the health of the community and industry as a whole.

I think Paizo will do just fine, although I would be surprised if they aren't accounting for a slight dip when 5e comes out in terms of their active player base. The simple fact of the matter is that Pathfinder is a rules heavy 3.5 variant, and that isn't every D&D player's cup o' tea. I'm guessing that some Pathfinder players aren't in love with the system itself, but play it because 4e isn't being developed anymore, and/or they like Paizo, or any number of other reasons. This isn't to put Pathfinder down at all, just to say that it speaks to a relatively specific crowd of D&D players.

But there are also a larger number of Pathfinder enthusiasts who wouldn't switch back to D&D even if 5e was a revised 3.5e, and there are probably quite a few who will keep their subscriptions, even if they buy 5e books and give the game a shot. But any loss in players to 5e in the short-term will, in the long-term, be offset by 5e being a quality game. Dungeons & Dragons is, and likely always will be, the flagship for tabletop RPGs. If D&D is healthy and thriving, then chances are the industry as a whole is healthy and thriving. Actually, 5e being a smash success may actually benefit Paizo in the long run.

@Morrus , there are small rodents on Alpha Centauri? Link, please.
 
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