I have a problem: I need arguments!!

[Michael Morris]

Ok, here's the skinny. The group I play with on Sunday night is still using 1st edition rules, sorta...

Actually they are barely getting by on rules pulled from all three editions cobbled together in a nightmarish scheme that even the DM can't sort out.

I would like to get the group to go to 3e, but I'm having trouble coming up with convincing arguments - I've tried many but I figured I'd poll you guys for more. Anything would be better than the current situation - even 1st edition without all the additions.

We play from about 4 to 10 Sunday. I'm going to try to get together a game from 2 to 4 to try to let them test 3e out. The problem is convincing them to give me those 2 hours :\

 

[LGodamus]

the main thing in my eyes is a simple system where all the elements mesh...basically all using the same mechanic....and after learning this system any new additions , like a new psionics supplement or even one of the many fine d20 games, become much easier to assimilate since they all follow the same simple format...not the mish mash of cluttered and varied mechanics that 1e and 2e ,moreso, became.

 

[WayneLigon]

What arguements have you already tried that have failed?

 

[Ashrem Bayle]

How about:

"Everybody else is doing it!"

Seriously though, all it will take is for you to get them to give you a few hours to SHOW them.

 

[D+1]

Shoot, go to any 1E/2E vs 3E flamewar either here or on rec.games.frp.dnd through Google and read up. No, no. Is too much. Let me sum up:

1) unified resolution mechanic for hit rolls, skill rolls, saves, etc.
2) a sensible initiative system that replaces the sad, illogical methods from previous editions.
3) to go along with #2, failed notions like weapon speed modifiers have been disposed of.
4) a combat and movement system that eliminates errors and misunderstandings between players and DM, and relieves the DM of the need for arbitrary rulings.
5)improvements in the skill system.
6) multiclassing rules that make sense
7) designed with tools for the DM to use to tailor encounters - indeed the entire game - around the capabilities of the PC's rather than just guessing at what to throw at them and hoping it lands somewhere between cakewalk and TotalPartyKill
8) a comprehensive framework to the whole game such that adding on or adjusting one part doesn't break other parts - it is house ruled friendly to allow you to play the game the way you want, not house rules _required_ to cover up the holes that make no sense or just plain don't work and never have.
9) saving throws that are based on something, not just arbitrary numbers from thin air.
10) use of alignment as a descriptor, not a behavior pattern for the DM to _enforce_.
11) working, integrated magic item creation system as part of the Core Rulesl
12) elimination of more long-standing faults with previous editions than can be recounted here.

There's more of course, but let them see for themselves. 3E sells itself when given its fair chance. Remind them that this is a different enough edition that they CANNOT compare it directly to previous editions to judge it fairly, they have to read/play it and judge it on its own merits, not by the fact that it ISN'T other editions.

 

[Alzrius]

If you're the DM, you can just say that its too hard for you to keep doing, since you're doing 90% of the work for the campaign.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Or, if you are a sneaky, manipulative bastiche, try running a 'short term game' of one of the variant settings. (Some of the ones from Dungeon would work for this.) Run something that is (mostly) unlike what they normally play, so they don't go into the game with old baggage.

Suggestions: Deadlands
Skull & Bones
If you can find a copy online try Vermin (PCs are cockroaches, rats, mice, squirrels, etc.) Believe it or not the game is a lot of fun

Grimm Tales might work as well.

Suck them into the new system this way.

The Auld Grump, who is a sneaky, manipulative bastiche. (But didn't need to go to such lengths, everyone was disappointingly happy with swapping...)

 

[Shadowdancer]

Challenge their masculinity. "Real men play 3E."

 

[RangerWickett]

Invite them here. Once they make friends, they'll never leave. Hurray!

 

[Cerubus Dark]

Invite them here. Once they make friends, they'll never leave. Hurray!

Nah first time Hong takes a swipe at one of them we may lose them...



But we still luvs ya Hong!