Identifying a wand

[kreynolds]

I'm sure you have a point, but I haven't the faintest idea what it is...?!

Actually, I just thought I had something funny there for a sec...then reality set in. Ah well.

 

[Kershek]

As long as Identify (or similar method) has been used somewhere in the process, and as long as all recipients of said knowledge can actually understand it, then thats fine. Make sense?

I have been trying real hard to try to understand your line of thinking, kreynolds. But I'm sorry, it doesn't make sense to me.

Our group, though, has been treating it like a command word activated item (but needing the spell in your spell list), so perhaps we've been doing it wrong all this time.

 

[Hypersmurf]

As long as Identify (or similar method) has been used somewhere in the process, and as long as all recipients of said knowledge can actually understand it, then thats fine. Make sense?

Now. An evil cleric with Craft Wands finds two perfectly identical sticks. Obviously a sign, he decides, and uses them to create a Wand of Cure Light Wounds and a Wand of Cure Moderate Wounds.

Then he puts them in his pack.

The next day, one of his henchmen gets hurt, and since he hasn't prepared any Cure spells, the cleric pulls his two wands out of his pack.

But he can't tell them apart! Despite the fact that he made the wands, that he knows both of them can only be one of two possible spells... following your argument through would lead me to believe you wouldn't let him use either one until he had one of them Identified. (At which point, having learned his lesson, he'd tie a piece of string around one of them so he can differentiate them in future...)

-Hyp.

 

[kreynolds]

But he can't tell them apart! Despite the fact that he made the wands, that he knows both of them can only be one of two possible spells... following your argument through would lead me to believe you wouldn't let him use either one until he had one of them Identified.

OK, I think this argument is going beyond silly at this point. That's not what I would do at all. He made them. To impose such a penalty on him has no point. I have no idea how you came to such a conclussion.

 

[kreynolds]

I have been trying real hard to try to understand your line of thinking, kreynolds. But I'm sorry, it doesn't make sense to me.

It's been evolving throughout the discussion, so I can't blame you.

Our group, though, has been treating it like a command word activated item (but needing the spell in your spell list), so perhaps we've been doing it wrong all this time.

You have. A wand has to be identified, either by yourself or someone else that can relay the information to you, before it can be used.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Your ruling about the item having been identified somewhere back down the chain just feels strange.

An adventurer finds two wands, each made of ebony, with a little carving of two fiendish hawks circling the shaft. (They're both Summon Monster II, you see.)

He takes them to a wizard. The wizard casts Identify on one of them. "It's Summon Monster II," he tells the adventurer. "Do you want to pay me to identify the other one as well?"

"No, thanks," the adventurer demurs. "It's pretty obvious."

The adventurer takes them to a Magic Shoppe and sells them to the shopkeeper. "They're Summon Monster II," he informs the merchant.

A week later, a sorcerer arrives. "What are these?" he asks the shopkeeper. "They're Summon Monster II," comes the (completely accurate) reply. "I'll take them," the sorcerer decides.

And yet, while both are spell-trigger activation items - containing the same spell! - which are on the sorcerer's list, he can only make one of them work... because an adventurer was too cheap to have a Divination spell cast on the other one?

-Hyp.

 

[Kershek]

You have. A wand has to be identified, either by yourself or someone else that can relay the information to you, before it can be used.

Well, we have been identifying wands to get the command word, unless they succeed in a DC 30 Spellcraft check to determine how to trigger it themselves.

 

[kreynolds]

Your ruling about the item having been identified somewhere back down the chain just feels strange.

Its either that or it has to be re-identified every time its in new hands. The DMG is very specific in that you must identify a wand before you can use it.

An adventurer finds two wands, each made of ebony, with a little carving of two fiendish hawks circling the shaft. (They're both Summon Monster II, you see.)

I'm following so far, but it doesn't matter that you (the DM) know what's in the wands. Just because they look alike doesn't mean they really are the same, and its this little fact that is most important in regards to the player that found the wands.

He takes them to a wizard. The wizard casts Identify on one of them. "It's Summon Monster II," he tells the adventurer. "Do you want to pay me to identify the other one as well?"

"No, thanks," the adventurer demurs. "It's pretty obvious."

Is it obvious? Why? Who says? How does he know? The character is making an assumption. Though you (the DM) know that they are both the same, the character doesn't.

And yet, while both are spell-trigger activation items - containing the same spell! - which are on the sorcerer's list, he can only make one of them work... because an adventurer was too cheap to have a Divination spell cast on the other one?

Yup, and for the reasons I state in the previous answer. The second wand was never identified by any of the involved parties. Not once. Ever. Thus, nobody knows what spell is in there. The fact that it looks the same does not guarantee that it is. If that were the case, then players would never have to worry about cursed items...

Player 1: Oh look! A brand new Sunblade!
Player 2: Careful! How do you know it isn't cursed?
Player 1: Because it looks just like a non-cursed one. If it looks identical, it is identical.

See what I mean?

 

[Kaji]

Hypersmurf's right, that does not make any sense. No matter what the "right" answer is, I'm comfortable with my house rule.

 

[kreynolds]

...unless they succeed in a DC 30 Spellcraft check to determine how to trigger it themselves.

Right, but that's incorrect in regards to wands.