Identifying "old school" adventure modules

[billd91]

Three of the modules identified as old school (including the most old school -- ToH) have illustration packs giving visuals for many rooms. Three of the four in the A series (A1 is chosen as old school) have detailed room graphics showing monster placement.

Is boxed text really a part of schoolness philosophy, or was it just a design technology? If someone had thought of boxed text in 1977, would Gygax have used it in his early materials? I think he probably would, because many of his modules included room descriptions in the text -- breaking that out into a boxed section helps the DM.

Bullgrit

Remember. This is a spectrum and not a hard and fast, either/or designation. I'm not going to disqualify Blondie from being a new wave/punk band just because they have one hit with a disco beat.

 

[Henry]

Three of the modules identified as old school (including the most old school -- ToH) have illustration packs giving visuals for many rooms. Three of the four in the A series (A1 is chosen as old school) have detailed room graphics showing monster placement.

I'd still say it's different from the "map table" setup of some of the newer Dungeon Delve stuff - but then, it wasn't graphic placement that every bothered me, it's just a waste of space to me to do it for every single encounter. I'd rather only do it when the setup could be both important to the encounter, and the encounter is complex.

And I really don't remember A1 having exact placement of all critters on the maps - maybe in a couple of sections (the aphid-thingies in the slave pens, maybe?) but not very many other places. I'll have to look at that when I get my hands on my old A1.

Is boxed text really a part of schoolness philosophy, or was it just a design technology? If someone had thought of boxed text in 1977, would Gygax have used it in his early materials? I think he probably would, because many of his modules included room descriptions in the text -- breaking that out into a boxed section helps the DM.

Bullgrit

I never really had a problem with boxed text per se, just boxed text that went to the trouble of presuming certain actions on the part of the PCs. They got better at that in recent years, but about 15 years ago it reached its peak with some of the AD&D2 modules. That forest Oracle module from about 25 years back was the king of "crazy boxed text" examples.

 

[Bullgrit]

I'm not going to disqualify Blondie from being a new wave/punk band just because they have one hit with a disco beat.

You mean they're not a rap group because of "Rapture"?

Bullgrit

 

[Bullgrit]

And I really don't remember A1 having exact placement of all critters on the maps - maybe in a couple of sections (the aphid-thingies in the slave pens, maybe?) but not very many other places. I'll have to look at that when I get my hands on my old A1.

I don't think A1 had such. But A2-A4 does have room maps showing exact placement for the monsters. I think it's funny -- I used to think that was very smart and helpful for a DM back in the day, but now some use it as an example of how things have gone wrong. But I would agree that it might have been taken further than really necessary, nowadays.

That forest Oracle module from about 25 years back was the king of "crazy boxed text" examples.

I love this thread on that module:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/genera...st-tsr-adventure-module-s-ever-published.html

Bullgrit

 

[jaerdaph]

You mean they're not a rap group because of "Rapture"?

Blondie is old school rap. Fab Five Freddie IN THE HOUSE!

 

[billd91]

I think it's funny -- I used to think that was very smart and helpful for a DM back in the day, but now some use it as an example of how things have gone wrong.

Or an example of how things have simply changed. And whenever you've got differences due to these changes, you're going to have some people who prefer one to the other. It doesn't necessarily mean things have gone wrong in some absolute sense, but from the perspective of the people preferring the previous state of things.

 

[Ariosto]

And "What would Gary hypothetically have done?" is not the standard I've seen from anyone but Bullgrit.

Boxed "read-aloud" text is another of those things suited to tournament needs. It helps to ensure that all teams are given the same information. The feasibility of that depends on a scenario structure ensuring that the information is indeed going to be relevant whenever and however the players encounter the things described.

A box or other distinctive formatting to help organize material is a pretty good idea. The text itself is not always helpful, though. Thinking in terms of a script for the DM to read can be inferior to thinking in terms of imparting information most usefully to the DM. Every now and then, one encounters "read-aloud" text that is ludicrously useless.

The whole script business, putting its emphasis on monologues by the DM rather than on dialog between DM and player, naturally lends itself to the "scenario writer as story teller" -- in this case, even as "masterful narrative stylist" -- persuasion.

 

[Bullgrit]

And "What would Gary hypothetically have done?" is not the standard I've seen from anyone but Bullgrit.

And here's where the discussion stops being enjoyable for me. When someone misrepresents what I've said and attributes to me a stance and belief that I have not taken and do not believe. This is where discussion for understanding and information turns to argument for winning or losing.

Ariosto, please don't take this discussion down this route. Don't put words in my mouth.

Bullgrit

 

[Ariosto]

I'm sorry. Your precise words were:

Is boxed text really a part of schoolness philosophy, or was it just a design technology? If someone had thought of boxed text in 1977, would Gygax have used it in his early materials?

I thought you meant the second sentence to have some bearing on the first.

 

[Hussar]

Heh, anyone who thinks that Mr. Gygax was afraid to use boxed text, should take a look at Isle of the Ape. Now THERE'S boxed text.

Would that be an old school or new school module?