D&D 5E I'm really hating Constitution right now

[Shiroiken]

The best method I've seen for fixing this:

When you roll for HP (taking the "average" is not allowed), you roll 1 additional die for each modifier you have. If your modifier is positive, you pick the highest die, and if it's negative, you pick the lowest die.

This makes Con worthwhile, but not super-important. Having only a +1 would satisfy most players. For monsters (unless you roll their HP), reduce the their HP bonus from Con by about half. Myself, I would use this but have everyone start with half Con score HP, and roll HP at 1st level.

 

[FrogReaver]

10 hp is negligible at level 5????

 

[jgsugden]

I almost always put a 13 in my Con at 1, but often would take Resilient after 10th level.

 

[Satyrn]

The best method I've seen for fixing this:

When you roll for HP (taking the "average" is not allowed), you roll 1 additional die for each modifier you have. If your modifier is positive, you pick the highest die, and if it's negative, you pick the lowest die.

This makes Con worthwhile, but not super-important. Having only a +1 would satisfy most players. For monsters (unless you roll their HP), reduce the their HP bonus from Con by about half. Myself, I would use this but have everyone start with half Con score HP, and roll HP at 1st level.

For clarity, I just want to confirm an assumption: You would no longer apply the Constitution modifier to your hit point total, right?

 

[Satyrn]

Anyway, I think if I really thought this was a problem for me, I'd just give the characters max hit points and drop the Con modifier from the calculation.

Though the Con mod would still apply for things like spending HD to heal . . . oh and maybe I'd toss in that every time you are healed your Con mod affects that value.

 

[Xeviat]

To everyone saying "your combat is too deadly", as I said, 4 of these players are brand new to the game. Of the other 11 characters, three more of the players were new to my games. Only 2 of the players in this player circle have played in my games before. So, I don't believe that's the issue.

I agree that on paper, +1 hp/level isn't that big. That's why Toughness is +2/level to be worth a feat.

Constitution is almost entirely a passive stat. It's boring. "I'm tough as nails" IS a character concept and it should be rewarded, but I haven't seen anyone consider a 10 Con as far as I can remember.

In 2E, and my only exposure to that was the Infinity Engine games, Con did nothing for you until 15, right? Well, that means there were probably plenty of lower con characters back then because the bar for it to help your HP was set so high.

As for saying the mental scores would be more important if the game were more social, I feel like groups do just okay as long as somebody covers each skill. Skills, other than perception really, are mostly active use. If a character has a poor Deception skill, the player sort of chose that and accepts that their character isn't a good liar. It doesn't get in the way of them playing their character.

In a real time video game, I could choose to play a less tough character if I can counter that by having them be nimble or protect them in another way. But D&D characters don't get to choose when to evade; AC is passive, and Dodge isn't a reaction. So, we're back to high Con.

In 4E, Con score was added to your HP, and Con Mod added to your healing surges. I didn't care to focus on Con on a character who was long ranged, or who was Str based and needed another high secondary stat. In fact, I often avoided Str/Con builds because of what they did to your defenses in a lot of cases.

Con score to HP would be a constant +10 HP buff to Con 10 characters.
Con 12 would gain +11 HP that would go away by 11th level, then they'd fall behind.
Con 14 would start with +12 HP, and would be neutral at 6th level.
Con 16 would start with +13 HP, but fall behind at 5th level.

If HD recovered fully on a long rest, and if Con mod applied to HD healing, then Con would still contribute to health over the day. I'm going to make a spread sheet and try to find a balance point.


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[Oofta]

If you have new characters, they may simply not understand the value of the other attributes. People are familiar with hit points from games, and it's something easy to grasp onto. In my games I try to make a variety of skills and ability checks useful so that different PCs have their own time to shine.

But once again, I have to ask. Why does it matter? Your players have created characters they want to play.

Are they having fun? Enjoying the game? They're playing the game right.

 

[Satyrn]

In 2E, and my only exposure to that was the Infinity Engine games, Con did nothing for you until 15, right? Well, that means there were probably plenty of lower con characters back then because the bar for it to help your HP was set so high.

Every ability score only started getting bonuses around 15, though, so that's gonna skew things so much more.

 

[Xeviat]

But once again, I have to ask. Why does it matter? Your players have created characters they want to play.

Are they having fun? Enjoying the game? They're playing the game right.

Because it's a boring non-choice. No one says "I want to play a Con 14 character". They may say "I want to play a tough character", but what does that mean when everyone is playing a tough character?

I just set up a spread sheet to compare the core rules against the following changes: 1) Con score to HP at first level, 2) No Con mod to HP per level, and 3) Recover all spent HD on a long rest. After lower levels, with the observed Con 14 baseline, characters have less HP in a single combat, but more endurance across the day.

It ends up being a net HP gain for everyone, all 28 possible HD and Con mod combination. It's a larger increase for low Con characters, and a lower increase for high Con characters.

I wouldn't change monsters much. I might rejigger the HP for low CR monsters a little, so low level combats are still difficult. Monsters would just have more HD if it mattered.


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[Shiroiken]

For clarity, I just want to confirm an assumption: You would no longer apply the Constitution modifier to your hit point total, right?

Correct. It still overall increases HP with a positive modifier (or reduces with a negative), but it keeps the HP within the parameters of the HD, providing a hard cap. Additionally, there is a point of diminishing returns, rather than a linear benefit. The person who worked this figured it to be about (assuming 1d8, IIRC):

+/- 1 = ~1 HP per level
+/- 2 = ~1.5 HP per level
+/- 3 = ~2 HP per level
+/- 4 = ~2.25 HP per level
+/- 5 = ~2.5 HP per level

Not a math guy, so I can't really confirm this though. If accurate, then a +1 mod is really the optimal situation for HP, with additional modifiers primarily helping with checks and saves (like every other ability).