I'm stocked for life! (But what if no one cares?)

[gizmo33]

I don't have a "die hard gaming group of five friends who have been with me for ten years", unlike many of you. So recruiting new players is always a concern in the back of my mind. :\

Me neither. I've DMed a whole range of people, from close friends to friends of friends, to near strangers who heard from someone at work that I was running a game. What they all have in common, unlike people with too much time to vent on the internet, is that their priority is to play in an RPG. Much further down the list is griping whether or not AoOs make any sense - or the typical kinds of stuff that the internet seems to breed easily.

Hows this - try posting on this message board something to the effect of: "Hey, everything's cool with me. I like a lot of different games and don't care much what I play." That sort of silent majority is not well-represented on the internet.

 

[Storm Raven]

Oh, I have. Many times. Try a poll on enworld or rpg.net asking how many players would be willing to play an AD&D 2e campaign, for example: you'll find a majority will say, "Yech, no way!"

The question is, for how many is that response driven by the fact that they just don't like 2e, and for how many is that response driven by the fact that it is not the most current edition of D&D? For me, for example, I wouldn't play in a 2e game because I don't like 2e. I didn't like it when it was the most current edition of the game, and I still don't like it now (in point of fact, 2e was what made me start playing Rolemaster and GURPS).

On the other hand, I like the d20 based 3.x D&D system. Even if I get 4e books (if and when they are published) I could probably easily be convinced to play a 3e or 3.5e game, just as I could probably be convinced to play a 1e game these days.

 

[Johnnie Freedom!]

The question is, for how many is that response driven by the fact that they just don't like 2e, and for how many is that response driven by the fact that it is not the most current edition of D&D? For me, for example, I wouldn't play in a 2e game because I don't like 2e. I didn't like it when it was the most current edition of the game, and I still don't like it now (in point of fact, 2e was what made me start playing Rolemaster and GURPS).
.

Fair enough. I was simply responding to gizmo's ridiculous assertion that he has "never" met a player who refuses to play by a certain set of rules. If that's the case, he should try running 2e and he'll find LOTS of players who refuse to play by those rules.

WHY they play by those rules is another matter (which you address in your post).

 

[gizmo33]

BTW, I'm set for life to play 3E primarily because I own:
1. dice
2. pencils
3. some paper

I know it's possible that younger people might not remember a time when a truck wasn't backing up to their house with the latest shipment of gaming stuff from Amazon. Thing is, when I was 12 there really weren't alot of RPG materials available. You might be lucky to see the old Holmes basic box in a toystore somewhere.

It didn't matter, though, because I could sketch out some dungeons on graph paper and we played. And as far as quality, my ability to run a published module was such that my homebrew stuff was usually as entertaining in the execution as my butchering of a published module anyway.

Bottom line is - DnD is in here (Gizmo points to your heart.)

 

[gizmo33]

Fair enough. I was simply responding to gizmo's ridiculous assertion that he has "never" met a player who refuses to play by a certain set of rules.

Not in person. I've never met anyone who has called something I said ridiculous with so little thought in person either - but I meet plenty on the internet. People say all sorts of stupid things on the internet that would cause them more problems in real life. Therefore, I don't take it seriously as an indication of what real life is going to be like.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

My guess is that - not a year out, mind you, but, say, four or five years out - independent OGL games like Mutants & Masterminds, which, if 4e is closed, will go even more their own way, will be easier to find or found groups for than 3.x D&D.

Most 'D&D Matters' people will ultimately be loyal to the brand - they will move on to the newest thing with D&D on the cover without ever considering other possibilities, just as they buy, eventually, the newest MS or Apple OS, the newest game console from the maker they prefer, the newest Final Fantasy, the newest iteration of Warhammer. Even when those aren't the best options for them, their inclination is to follow the brand.

Most 'system matters' people dabble in d20/OGL material already, and some actively prefer it (I'd say most of EN World falls into the 'system matters' category). Those who prefer 4e will switch, those who don't will increasingly use d20/OGL material (and continue to buy it). When the amount of OGL material they use exceeds the amount of Wizards material, those OGL games that get the most continuing support will be their main games - and semi-compatible or non-compatible games will get the most continuing support if 4e isn't open.

Most 'system doesn't matter' people who are nonetheless hardcore gamers will play whatever the GM brings to the table. 'System doesn't matter' people who are casual gamers will play the current edition of D&D because it's played, and available for purchase, pretty much everywhere. They probably won't want to learn a new (or old) rulesset.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

Not in person. I've never met anyone who has called something I said ridiculous with so little thought in person either - but I meet plenty on the internet. People say all sorts of stupid things on the internet that would cause them more problems in real life. Therefore, I don't take it seriously as an indication of what real life is going to be like.

FWIW, I've declined to play in a game because of system at least three times IRL (and meant it; the games weren't important enough to me to put up with a system I didn't much care for), and I've known at least a dozen other people who have done so. In at least three cases, players dropped because of system despite enjoying (and regularly attending) the GM's games in systems they liked.

 

[WayneLigon]

I suspect and fear that once 4e comes along, we can chant, "3.5 for-evAH" all we want, but it will mean nothing, since most players will automatically choose the Shiny New Thing.

RuneQuest 3 is the only new edition of a game I have ever seen where new players stayed away in droves. I'm sure that - unless WoTC blunders horribly in some bizarre way the way AH did, something I don't forsee happening - some people will stick with 3.0 and 3.5, but the vast majority will move on to 4E, and virtually all the new people coming into the hobby will go for 4E.

 

[gizmo33]

FWIW, I've declined to play in a game because of system at least three times IRL (and meant it; the games weren't important enough to me to put up with a system I didn't much care for), and I've known at least a dozen other people who have done so. In at least three cases, players dropped because of system despite enjoying (and regularly attending) the GM's games in systems they liked.

I'm sure there out there, but the point was, FWIW, I haven't met them. In fact, what I meant to say was that I've never met someone who expressed these thoughts outloud. I very well could have met someone that had those preferences but just chose not to tell me about it.

(Edit: OH! - one of my friends DID actually say that he wouldn't play 3E when it first came out, but then I ran a game and he showed up and has been playing ever since. Apparently, his opinion as it would have sounded on the internet wound up looking a lot different in real life. I guess I was wrong on this all along, but for some reason it doesn't seem like it matters...)

But who cares, I guess. The question, seemed to me, was whether or not this would be a significant issue in finding people to play. What I tried to say in my answer was, no - I think finding a DM who is motivated to run a 3E game, or being such a DM yourself, is probably much more significant than whatever WotC is selling at the time.

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

There will be people who move on and people who don't. For those who don't, there will still be games. I mean, I'm still playing 1e -- lots of 1e -- and I don't seem to struggle to find players even for a ruleset that's nearly thirty years old.