Immortals Handbook, what format interests you?

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Upper_Krust,

Hi there War Golem!

By the way is your nom de plume and Avatar from BattleChasers by any chance?

I voted for hardcover at $30.

Thanks!

I have been following your threads on the WPS for months, if not always diligently, then at least anxiously.

Well hey, thanks again! I appreciate the support.

I don't know that I will ever run a campaign for Immortal PCs, but I love pantheons and gods and wouldn't trade my 1e D&D (w/moorcook & Cthulhu) for anything.

I think at one point I had pretty much every deity in Legends & Lore (1st Ed.) memorised.

"Know your enemy and know yourself and you will never be defeated in a hundred battles." etc.

I am very excited just to read through your work, and at some point, own a copy!

Cheers!

Anyway, thanks for all your hard work,

I'm sure it will all be worthwhile.

and your tireless marketing efforts on the boards.

I generally only respond to posts, so if no one was interested in the work we wouldn't be here now.

In all the months I've been following your threads, you have always been unfailingly responsive and cordial. My hat's off to you, sir.

I just try and treat people with the same courtesy and respect I would like to be treated with. However, virtually everyone one these boards is uncommonly friendly and helpful, so I am sure I am not alone in that mantra.

Back to the book - I haven't seen anything in this thread so far about whether the illustrated version will be black-and-white or color?

To be honest I see the work being b&w rather than colour. The reason for this is of course cost.

WotC are (almost) the only company that can cover the costs of full colour artwork.

Which is why most other D20 companies are almost exclusively working in b&w.

A 272 page b&w book should retail for (approx.) $32.50 under current prices.

A 272 page full colour book is almost certainly going to be $40 and to be honest I think most d20 publishers would be wary of undertaking such an endeavour, and similarly the large price tag may dissuade undecided gamers.

I am a huge proponent of color artwork, and even more so if the artwork is good (there has been a distressingly large amount of bad artwork in d20 products).

I agree.

The solution is certanly better art; whether b&w or colour.

My first choice artist (whom I must stress has not yet been approached so I can't confirm his services at this time) is Feng Zhu:

www.artbyfeng.com

Let me know what you think!? Personally I think his style would be perfect. Hes also equally adept at b&w and colour.

For a hardbound book upwards of 300 pages of rules and "options" in which I'm interested, with good full-color art, I have no qualms about forking out more than $30.

Neither do I. But I anticipate we might well be in the minority here.

I have no regrets about the money I spent on the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, or Oriental Adventures

The art in the FRCS was seemingly squashed (no doubt to accomodate the massive amount of text) and didn't overly impress me.

The Oriental Adventures book is however, perfect. Easily my favourite d20 product so far in both design and content.

(I only wish I could say the same about the WotC splatbooks).

Anything with Wayne Reynolds art in it and I'm sold!.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi kolvar mate!

I voted for unillustrated pdf. I would probably not pay 30 bugs for a hard cover at the moment (i.e. not even for monte cooks secret project). And I want to read your ideas and rules, Upper_Krust, in an ordered way.

Thanks!

I am not eager to see pictures (else I could hop over to Elfwood).

I take your point, although I have always felt that monsters (even those based on great ideas ) are going to be somewhat anaemic without artwork.

 

[War Golem]

Hey U_K,

I'm not nearly as adept with the replying with quote feature of the boards as you obviously are; hopefully I can just reply to a couple of your points in order and you'll figure it out.

Battlechasers - aye. I'm not much of a comic fan any longer, but I loved that comic. I considered using Red Monika for my name and Avatar, but decided I really don't have the chest to pull it off.
Sadly, I understand the comic is dead as of issue 9 or so; Joe M. is off to work on a game design project (anyone know anything about that?)

Color art - I realize most d20 publishers can't handle the costs of full-color. too bad, really. Other than WotC, I think AEG and Bastion Press have put out full-color books (take a look at "Minions", if you haven't seen it yet). But I'll agree good b/w art is preferable to lousy color art, and yes, Feng Zhu would be awesome! His stuff is great. I've had him listed on my web site for some time now:
http://www.ah69.com/links/fantasyart.htm

I concur about Wayne Reynolds; unfortunately, either he or WotC is phasing his work out of the splatbooks, MotW is almost all Cramer's stuff (which I don't like).

Cheers.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey U_K,

Hey War Golem mate!

I'm not nearly as adept with the replying with quote feature of the boards as you obviously are;

I still remember posting about a year ago and asking 'how do you use these quote thingies!?'

Like anything else, once you know how its easy peasy. If you want to try things out I would suggest going to the Meta Boards and quoting to some test threads therein.

hopefully I can just reply to a couple of your points in order and you'll figure it out.

Sure, no problem.

Battlechasers - aye. I'm not much of a comic fan any longer, but I loved that comic. I considered using Red Monika for my name and Avatar, but decided I really don't have the chest to pull it off.

I don't actually own Battlechasers personally but a friend of mine owns a comic shop so I get to read anything I want.

I only buy Thor and Hellboy (or anything by Mignola) religiously, just picked up the Graphic Novel of 'The Conqueror Worm' (even though I had all the issues already ) today.

Sadly, I understand the comic is dead as of issue 9 or so; Joe M. is off to work on a game design project (anyone know anything about that?)

I knew they weren't making any more but other than that I can't help you.

Color art - I realize most d20 publishers can't handle the costs of full-color. too bad, really. Other than WotC, I think AEG and Bastion Press have put out full-color books (take a look at "Minions", if you haven't seen it yet).

I knew one or two other publishers had tried it (from reviews at ENWorld) but couldn't remember who exactly.

But I'll agree good b/w art is preferable to lousy color art, and yes, Feng Zhu would be awesome!

Realistically 'we' might not be able to afford his services. But I plan to email him and ask him to see what he says anyway.

His stuff is great. I've had him listed on my web site for some time now:

A fellow fan of Feng Zhu - and I thought I was one of the few who had heard of him.

http://www.ah69.com/links/fantasyart.htm

I noticed you didn't have Wayne Reynolds site there.

I would be interested in reading through the Godswar when I get a bit of time on my hands.

I concur about Wayne Reynolds;

He is one of the artists (along with Mike Mignola and Feng Zhu) who, in my eyes can do no wrong, and are just as competent with b&w as with colour.

unfortunately, either he or WotC is phasing his work out of the splatbooks, MotW is almost all Cramer's stuff (which I don't like).

Don't be telling me that I was looking forward to seeing Wayne Reynolds art in MotW!

Cheers.

Take care.

 

[War Golem]

Hey U_K,

I'd be happy to add Wayne's site to my list; just didn't know he had an official web site. Still not sure, actually. I just did a Google search and came up with this:
http://www.onlinegamescompany.com/war/

Any idea if this is his "official" site? Do you know of another one for his work?


Godswar is a series of journal entries for the campaign I played in back in college. It's got a lot of interesting stuff in it (the DM was a very imaginative fellow, his wild and crazy imagination was the high point of his DMing style, I think), but given your interests and the name of the campaign, I'm not sure it will be quite what you would expect; we weren't playing immortals or anything. But we did end up saving the world... sort of.

Cheers.

 

[The Burned Man]

"A fellow fan of Feng Zhu - and I thought I was one of the few who had heard of him."

I´ve heard of him too. I think I posted some of his pictures, way back.

Since he works on movies and videogames I think his prices will be way high...

Here are some other great artists...

Mike May

http://www.mikespencil.com/

Stephanie Law

http://www.shadowscapes.com/gal_ANGELS.shtml

Jean-Pierre Targette

http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database/art/list.pl?gallery=69

and others who´se links I´ve misplaced

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey U_K,

Hey mate!

I'd be happy to add Wayne's site to my list; just didn't know he had an official web site. Still not sure, actually. I just did a Google search and came up with this:
http://www.onlinegamescompany.com/war/

Any idea if this is his "official" site? Do you know of another one for his work?

As far as I know this is the official site - its certainly the one I am familiar with.

Godswar is a series of journal entries for the campaign I played in back in college. It's got a lot of interesting stuff in it (the DM was a very imaginative fellow, his wild and crazy imagination was the high point of his DMing style, I think), but given your interests and the name of the campaign, I'm not sure it will be quite what you would expect; we weren't playing immortals or anything. But we did end up saving the world... sort of.

Hey! The main point is that you all had fun!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Burned mate!

"A fellow fan of Feng Zhu - and I thought I was one of the few who had heard of him."

I´ve heard of him too. I think I posted some of his pictures, way back.

No way! I check all your posts - I would have remembered if you had mentioned him!

Since he works on movies and videogames I think his prices will be way high...

True, but it never hurts to ask.

"Here are some other great artists...

Mike May

http://www.mikespencil.com/

Fantastic, he does seem to favour cartoonish illustrations, though some of his 'serious' fantasy peices are amazing.

"Stephanie Law

http://www.shadowscapes.com/gal_ANGELS.shtml

Stephanie is always brilliant, some of her peices would be perfect for the Immortals Handbook too... c'est la vie I suppose.

"Jean-Pierre Targette

http://www.epilogue.net/cgi/database/art/list.pl?gallery=69

and others who´se links I´ve misplaced

Very nice.

Thanks for the links Burned Man (though since I follow your threads, naturally I was familiar with all the above! )

 

[Vaxalon]

No thanks, I'll just go to the original source and use Primal Order. If any of my buddies get it, though, I'll take a look and see if they're as similar as they appear to be.

 

[Upper_Krust]

By the way thanks for all the replies so far, very enlightening.

Hi Vaxalon mate!

No thanks, I'll just go to the original source and use Primal Order. If any of my buddies get it, though, I'll take a look and see if they're as similar as they appear to be.

I appreciate the candour.

The fundamental differences between the two is that the Primal Order bases power on realms and has religious roots (power handed from gods to mortals) whereas the Immortals Handbook bases power on worshippers and has atheistical roots (mortals create gods through worship).

Though, the Immortals Handbook actual details both types of deities both 'spirit'* (power via realms) and 'soul' (power via worshippers). Its even possible for a deity to do both.

*These are typically Outsider (Demon Princes, Archdukes) or Elemental (Elemental Lords) types though.

I'll be interested in hearing your comments when you eventually get to see it!?