D&D 5E interview with Jeremy Crawford on Eberron: Rising from the Last War

[Charlaquin]

First of all that is incredibly rude.

It went a little far, yes.

Second, Yes, I'm also glad that we got the Wayfinder's content for 18 months. I would rather that they put all the adventure and new monster material, etc. that @Parmandur says in the new book into the new book and left all the Wayfarer's Guide as it was. I would gladly have bought both if they didn't have so much overlap.

Overlap of crunch between products should kinda be expected of 5e at this point. It has happened multiple times now, and will likely keep happening, due in part to the AL PHB+1 rule. I understand a lot of people are not too keen on that, but it should really have been expected that the eventual Eberron hardcover would include all of the crunch necessary to play Eberron without a second book, as it has been standard practice this edition that each supplement book is written to be fully usable with no other books beyond the basic rules. An Eberron hardcover without rules for playing all the standard Eberron races, backgrounds, and Dragonmarks would not meet this standard.

Thirdly, WotC were up front that Wayfinders was a living document. Yes. They were upfront that it was going to be updated playtest changes yes.

However, Mike Mearls repeatedly calls Wayfinder Official content on twitter following its release for the very many people who were confused about what exactly Wayfinder's was supposed to be as it seemed ot live in this weird interstitial space.

It is official. The release of another book with much of the same crunch content does not make it unofficial.

They also made statements that the Artificer would be included once it was complete, not part of the Artificer.

The artificer will be included in Wayfinder’s once it’s complete. Just because more Artificer subclasses will exist in another book doesn’t make it “part of the Artificer” any more than the existence of the Arcane Archer in Xanathar’s makes the PHB Fighter “part of the Fighter.” Or for that matter, the existence of the battlemaster in the PHB makes the Fighter in the basic rules “part of the Fighter.”

So while it may have been clear to some that WotC was going to subsume the greater part of Wayfinders for a future book, it wasn't to many many people (based on the twitter from around its release) that that was going to happen.

I’m sorry you feel mislead, but I think WotC was abundantly clear that this would be what would happen.

I don't see taking almost all the crunch from Wayfinders and putting it into another book that has the rest of the Artificer plus other new content to be "complementary".

They put almost all of the crunch from the Elemental Evil Player’s Guide in Xanathar’s, and much of it in SCAG as well. The crunch is a relatively small portion of any 5e supplement book. I understand that you don’t think the fluff counts, but WotC disagrees with you. Until you accept that that’s the way they’re doing things this edition, you are likely to continue to be disappointed this way.

 

[Azzy]

Also, it isn’t as if they didn’t clearly state that Wayfinder’s was basically early access playtesting for a future release. Folks who are upset that the material is being reproduced should maybe have paid more attention to what they were buying.

Also, it serves a different purpose. Wayfinders was very much an introductory product—perfect for those that know little or nothing about the setting and getting them up to speed with the setting and its feel. It's very player friendly, in that it gives you the information you need to create a character and fit it into the world. Rising is probably going to take a more traditional approach of a campaign setting, giving more emphasis on details of the setting and worldbuilding than hand holding those new to the setting.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Maybe it is possible to sneak a personal discount code for eberron rising from the last war on dndbeyond into the wayfairer's guide to eberron digital copies?

 

[Warforged DK]

First of all that is incredibly rude.

I'm sorry, it was rude. No excuses, just an apology.

Second, Yes, I'm also glad that we got the Wayfinder's content for 18 months. I would rather that they put all the adventure and new monster material, etc. that @Parmandur says in the new book into the new book and left all the Wayfarer's Guide as it was. I would gladly have bought both if they didn't have so much overlap.

I get your reasoning, but I don't think WotC should expect players to buy 2 books to cover what 1 should. We've had material reprinted from one book to another- look at Elemental Evil and SCAG spells that were reprinted for XGtE. Granted, it's not 60 ish pages worth of reprint, but precedent is there and it fits along the PHB+1 mold for Adventurer's League. (Except that the AL player's guide for this new season references other books for patrons and backgrounds, so...)

They also made statements that the Artificer would be included once it was complete, not part of the Artificer.

I'm with you on this- Full Artificer should be updated into Wayfinders.



[/QUOTE]

 

[Ruin Explorer]

One Subclass is the whole Class. More are not required. Mearls also said that literally all of the crunch was likely to be repeated I any future hardcover, which came to pass. We know that not all of the WGtE is being reprinted, per D&D Beyond, so I'd say keep an open mind.

The artificer will be included in Wayfinder’s once it’s complete. Just because more Artificer subclasses will exist in another book doesn’t make it “part of the Artificer” any more than the existence of the Arcane Archer in Xanathar’s makes the PHB Fighter “part of the Fighter.” Or for that matter, the existence of the battlemaster in the PHB makes the Fighter in the basic rules “part of the Fighter.”

In general I agree with what you all are saying about WGtE, but I think I don't think this is right. It doesn't feel like good faith, it feels like "WELL TECHNICALLY!!!!" rather than honest intention. Every other class in the game has launched with at least two subclasses. You can't "choose your subclass" if there's only one subclass. On top of that, it feels like a double-technicality because they made the Artificer UA rather than putting it technically in WGtE, presumably partly in order to get away with this.

What I'm saying is, WotC have earned a huge amount of respect from me with most of their 5E decisions. I've never felt like they were trying to rip me off, or doing something cheap or "technical". Indeed, that was rarely the case in 3.XE or 4E.

But this feels like total money-grubbing cheapness of a disreputable, video-game-publisher kind. It genuinely lowers my respect for WotC and their business practices, and makes me not want to buy the new Eberron book (fortunately I probably don't have to as I think I'll get access via content-sharing on D&D Beyond with my DM in the Eberron game).

Comparisons with the free basic set are obviously not right. This isn't a free product, and they specifically promised the artificer. I could see including only 2 of the 3 subclasses, just so the new Eberron book had a bit of additional content, but only one? Rude and feels sleazy. Is it worth making my opinion of you go down WotC? Really?

I feel like an NPC in a computer game when the player selects some really ill-advised dialogue option and my opinion of them drops 20% on the reputation bar or something! Like Tyranny maybe "You have gained Wrath with Ruin Explorer" and WotC flips to the reputations page and sees they just went from like below 1 Wrath to over 3.

TLDR: Morrigan disapproves

 

[MechaTarrasque]

Well, the Basic Rules only come with one subclass per class, but that is free, so I leave it for wiser people than me to figure out if that is precedence or not....

 

[pukunui]

Is it worth making my opinion of you go down WotC? Really?

How much is your opinion worth to WotC? Do you have a lot of influence in the gaming world? If not, your opinion is probably not worth as much to them as you might like to think it is. If, however, you have the power to sway public opinion against them in a significant way, then it may actually be worth them paying attention to you.

 

[Parmandur]

OK, looked it up, Wayfinders Guide is 50,000 words, while RFtLW is 200,000. And, not all of the Wayfinders text us being reprinted. So, a sizeable amount of new content, 240 pages give or take (>75% of 320 pages).

 

[Ruin Explorer]

How much is your opinion worth to WotC? Do you have a lot of influence in the gaming world? If not, your opinion is probably not worth as much to them as you might like to think it is. If, however, you have the power to sway public opinion against them in a significant way, then it may actually be worth them paying attention to you.

Talk about missing the point entirely.

I'm not going to "zing them on my Twitter" or something!

But if they're managing to piss me off, as someone who really hasn't been annoyed with WotC for a very long time, and look sleazy to me, then they're definitely giving that impression to an awful lot of people. Hopefully this is a one-off bit of greedy idiocy (indeed, it would still be easy for them to correct it by simply putting one or two of the subclasses into the WGtE), but now they've crossed this particular line, people are going to be alert to similar things in future, and if it's representative oi a new attitude, rather than a one-off, that doesn't bode super-well for anyone, because even ultra-defensive hyper-fan types (naming no-names) who will excuse almost anything get tired of defending this stuff eventually.

OK, looked it up, Wayfinders Guide is 50,000 words, while RFtLW is 200,000. And, not all of the Wayfinders text us being reprinted. So, a sizeable amount of new content, 240 pages give or take (>75% of 320 pages).

It's good to hear the new book will have a lot of material, because Eberron material is usually gold (esp. when Baker is involved), but it still doesn't explain or justify the weird-ass decision re: subclasses. If anything it makes it weirder, because anyone running Eberron will want to get this book. Also the chart they released is hilarious because it looks exactly like one of those terrible "Pleb Edition" vs "Platinum Founder Turbo Edition" charts video games do to try and get you to spend $100+ on a $60 game.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I was very disappointed that the artificer was not in wayfinder´s guide.
I am also diappointed that not the whole class is in.
On the other hand, I bought it on DM´s guild and so It would make no difference, because I still have to get it on dndbeyond.
I was rather annoyed that I got it on dm´s guild to begin with because for a second time I only noticed the publication there and not on dndbeyond.
Maybe cross "platform" discount codes would be nice.