Interview with Scott Rouse, Chris Perkins & Bill Slavicsek

[Herremann the Wise]

Drinking from the firehose.

...I like the fire hose.

Hello Scott,

I thought I'd just put in a quick word of thanks for going to the effort of posting here on EN World. If you could manage to have a presence here similar to those from Paizo, I think you'll find the majority of your PR pain evaporating. [Thanks to Linae as well acting as scout and top gal for the WotC troops]. I hope to read more of your comments here over the coming days, weeks and months.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Scott_Rouse]

Ghendar, it looks like you, me, Wye and a bunch of others are all in the same boat. Nothing WotC is saying shows that they are targeting us as part of their new marketing strategy. Its a shame that it took all the yelling and screaming over the past week to finally get someone from WotC to tell us, but I'm glad they did.

Scott and lurkinglidda, I'm glad you guys are finally here. I hope you stay and participate for a long time. Don't let it take another fiasco to bring you out.

Devyn if you still like D&D you are in my marketing plans and strategy. There is no way in the 9 hells we are going to abandon you.

I hear that online is not for you but if you have a pulse and can still role dice then do we have product for you my friend (in my best infomercial voice). Seriously, we know that online magazines etc are not going to be for everyone. We are not abandoning the table top, play in your kitchen, experience that is D&D. If getting together with your friends, telling great stories, kicking in the door, killing monsters, and having some laughs is the experience you want to have, we will continue to deliver that. Lots of books, maps, tiles, minis, dice, and online stuff too.

 

[Scott_Rouse]

Heh. You should go see your WOTC board thread.

It is nice of you to try to make the uphill slog, though. I must admit. I'm skeptical about this whole thing for a lot of reasons, but it's really nice to see you guys try. Well, maybe :\

Fire Hose flame thrower it's all the same

 

[(contact)]

Point taken. To heart. We're sorta in a no-win situation right now. We do have a plan...we just aren't at liberty to reveal the details yet. That's an unacceptable answer, I'm totally aware, but we just can't talk details in, er..., detail just yet.

I hope we all underdstand this: it's not your fault *personally* that you're stuck inside a model that isn't working.

I can imagine how much it might suck to have job A that you really love and consumer base B that really loves A, and yet you can't connect the two.

But of course, secrecy and "strategic timing" isn't the only marketing model out there, and at the very least the powers that be could recognize that the organization is rapidly missing its window and shift. But yeah, good luck running that flag up the pole.

I just want to put out there that transparency invites your customers to identify with you, whereas opacity creates suspicion. Suspicion that becomes another unecessary hurdle that the product now has to jump. So the practical down-side to secrecy is that it really puts the pressure on the DI to deliver, which means people like me will be judging it a bit more critically than we might have otherwise.

At this point, the DI has got to be really good. Paizo's already got my subscription for their new initiative, but the WotC DI is going to have to bring it before I'll sign up. Not because of what it is, but because at this point I'm seeing red flags.

Anyway, you don't come to my job and bitch at me*, so I'll shut up now.

Thanks for showing up, and oh yeah . . . it is just a game!





















*Because I work at the McDonalds in Maplewood instead of the one in Renton.

 

[(contact)]

Whizbang, I agree with everything you just said. Except maybe the bit about it being easy to have done a better job. PR isn't easy.

But it is very predictable.

Unfortunately PR is mostly repetitive. Which is why it bombs sometimes. It's hard to really care when you're in PR. If you're lucky, you work on a client or two that you like, but even then consumer PR is pretty numbing stuff.

I've worked for several agencies (although I'm a 'creative' and not a strategist). In fact, one of those agencies had Hasbro prior to the WotC buy. I used to talk to the Hasbro client all the time, she was funny. When WotC was purchased I tried to get my managing director to go balls out after WotC's business, because I love D&D, but he couldn't be arsed about it.

Later, I worked on a proposal to win some of WotC's business put together by a boutique firm staffed by my TOEE2 gaming group (Heydricus and Prisantha, Z), but I don't think we ever had a shot.

It's demonstrably clear that the reaction was negative; it's not clear that the negative reaction could have been easily averted. I think no matter how WotC had broached the subject, the community would have howled. Moving Dragon and Dungeon completely online is simply a Big Deal.

A Big Deal which you could capitalize on. So I disagree with you here, Z. If they engaged immediately with their thinking and vision, they invite collaboration (or more realistically, the impression of collaboration, which is just as good . . . see also this thread). The gamers get to feel involved, listened to and cared about, even if they disagree.

It's like your buddy's band. They may not be very good, but you'll go see them anyway, because, hey, that's Dave up there. And since you know Dave busts his ass, you'll pay the door instead of trying to weasel in on the list. Ultimately, that's the value of brand loyalty -- consumers don't look at the warts.

But hey, let's not leave this dead baby on PR's doorstep. Consumer PR is not often very reactive, except for the crisis guys who very few people keep around. Exxon and Nike need crisis teams, Hasbro just makes games.

I do appreciate that Scott and lurkinglidda have let us know their situations (NDA'd up). Now I can identify with their position instead of having to draw my own (cynical) conclusions.

(thinks about it)

Oh my god, I'm a market segment.

(thinks about it)

Oh my god, we're *all* market segments . . . SOYLENT GREEN IS MARKET SEGMENTS!

 

[Khairn]

Devyn if you still like D&D you are in my marketing plans and strategy. There is no way in the 9 hells we are going to abandon you.

I hear that online is not for you but if you can still role dice then do we have product for you my friend (in my best infomercial voice). Seriously, we know that online magazines etc are not going to be for everyone. We are not abandoning the table top, play in your kitchen, experience that is D&D. If getting together with your friends, kicking in the door, killing monsters, and having some laughs is the the experience you want to have, we will continue to deliver that.

Lots of books, maps, tiles, minis, dice, and some online stuff too.

Scott, I really do appreciate the words, especially as I have been very honest with my emotions over the pending loss of Dragon & Dungeon, the 8 days of silence from WotC while the player base chewed on itself, and the little information that was actually shared in the questions you answered on this site. I really do want WotC, D&D and this hobby that I am passionate about, to thrive and grow.

But I have seen precious little that gives me hope that the DI will be successful. WotC's technical performance has been less than inspiring, with years of being unable to get a simple search function on a messageboard to work as just one example. IMHO the books that WotC has published over the last year have been less than "must-haves" and rarely been anything that I am interested in using. Now the magazines that WotC has scheduled for cancellation have for the most part been superior in many respects. So from my point of view I am losing two resources with a proven track record of high quality, and I'm really uncertain what I'm gaining. The new "Box, Crate and Sack Generator" that debuted today on the WotC site didn't really do anything for me.

On top of all that there is this nebulous vision of a new Digital Initiative ... a new business model that I have serious doubts will work with the RPG community. But again without any actual facts from WotC, all I come up with is this image of the growing similarities between the MMORPG business model and DI.

So for me, I feel I'm losing not just 2 iconic pieces of gaming history, I'm also losing proven gaming resources and actual "ownership" of that content for a computer and internet focused business model comprised of an unknown format, with unknown features and an unknown subscription rate.

I understand that there are limitations to what you can share with us. I'm disappointed that with a year to work on WotC's reaction to players when the announcements came out that this was the best that everyone came up with... but I do understand.

So with that being said, where do we stand? I've listened to you and hopefully you've listened to me. I still feel that I am no longer your target market, but you say that WotC is committed to providing me with the very best in gaming support and books for my game, even if I dont participate in DI.

OK then ... I'll wait and see what WotC comes up with. You and the rest of the crew at WotC have a steep hill to climb, and I doubt I'll make it easy. But I'll give you the chance to prove me wrong. Hopefully I'll meet you at the top of the hill. Maybe we can share an ale.



p.s. Scott ... You might want to have someone check out that Crate, Barrell and Sack Generator ... apparently a sack full of carrots is worth a couple of thousand gp. Perhaps the generator is not the best way to instill confidence in players already questioning WotC's ability to combine quality content and internet support. Just a thought.

 

[Mystical Forest]

Launch dollars rewarded

I know everything about Pathfinder -- it even already has a daily blog. I know nothing about WotC's project -- I don't even know its name.

I felt I had to reward the company that had information about its products, so I became a charter subscriber to Pathfinder. If I were to behave otherwise, I would have rewarded silence and I couldn't abide that.


P.S. As I was writing this post I got an email from Paizo whose title is "What's Pathfinder All About?"

That behavior reinforces my choice.

 

[Mouseferatu]

You know, I've got another theory to share. I'm sure some people will once again paint me with the "You're a freelancer, nothing you say can possibly be taken at face value brush," but the hell with 'em. I'm going to share it anyway.

(And again, my usual disclaimer: This is theory only, I have no inside knowledge, couldn't share it even if I did, blah, blah, blah.)

Is it possible that the reason WotC's web site and forums haven't been improved in the last year is because all their web-oriented resources are being devoted to the DI? Seems to me that would be the perfect time to launch the all-new, all-working, revamped web site, rather than trying to parcel it out a few bits at a time. And if I knew I was going to be putting out a brand new version of a web site, I seriously doubt I'd consider fixing problems on the old version--like, say, search function--to be a high priority.

 

[Truth Seeker]

By any chance, did you have short hair, last seen at Gen Con?

Tis true: I'm only slightly taller than the iconic Lidda. And there's no way I'll be having the baby at Gen Con...I'm all for PR stunts and stuff, but not on that level!

 

[Wye]

Lidda and I are here, we are trying to read everything (as are a few WOTC lurkers). We can't say a hell of a lot right now. We are NDA'd 8 ways until Sunday and there are just things we can't discuss. We will try to answer when posible and avoid the using the vague jibba jabba. This is largely on our own time as we have a lot of day to day stuff to do (unless you want us to stop making games haha) so it may be sporadic and we likely wont get into indivual conversations. But we really like the interaction and will do our best pop a beer (just me not Lidda), sit on the couch, and come in, hang out, and chat.

That paragraph made me say "thank you" three times. So, thank you.

All that bit about Hasbro is really interesting to me, thanks for sharing. And if anything, it made me breathe easier.

Paper is not going away. We have a product plan that goes out years (look we've already announced products through the end of 2007) and we are working on '08 stuff right now. We plan a long way out. We've got an idea of products that go out 5 years and further. There is a ton of paper products (and plastic) on the plan. Table top roleplaying is at the heart of the brand and as Bill said we are not changing that.

Now, that really lifts a weight off my shoulders. As a matter of fact, I just opened a beer! I guess I was really worried about that.

In response to Devyn you said:

...Seriously, we know that online magazines etc are not going to be for everyone. We are not abandoning the table top, play in your kitchen, experience that is D&D...

I'm glad you recognize that, but I'm still spectacularly pissed off by the halting of my beloved magazines in print, and I can't imagine anything that I'd like to have online instead. So it's a loss for me no matter how I look at it. I'm more than happy with the magazines and in a few months they'll be gone for me... Maybe if you license Greyhawk to Paizo, that will definitely put you in my good books for eternity *nudge*nudge*wink*wink*

Thank you for your time Scott, I really appreciate it.

A final note for other posters who downplay the importance of this "game". I started playing when I was 13, I'll turn 33 this year. I've been through highschool, college, jobs, moving (across countries), friends and girlfriends intermingled there, and marriage. Life is a rollercoaster, and the only constant throughout my life has been my weekly D&D game. It didn't matter if I was having trouble with my girlfriend, or if I had problems at my job, or if I had a little or a lot of money. D&D is my only constant. I enjoy getting together with my friends, disconnecting from reality, and using my brain and imagination; and though I probably have material for decades, I, like any kid at heart, love new toys. So, the well being of this "game" is important to me.