Intimidate/Very Low Charisma=Awe?

[Brother MacLaren]

As many others have said, Intimidate isn't just being scary. It's being scary in a way that gets people to do what you want. Big difference.
The half-orc barbarian Intimidates me, I flee, come back with a bunch of friends, and kill him. The high-Cha rogue Intimidates me, and I get the sense that whatever plan I come up with he'll be one step ahead of me. I know that I just shouldn't even try to mess with this guy.

 

[Glyfair]

Also, there are circumstance bonuses to consider. Someone who just killed your companion with one blow will certainly get bonuses to an intimidate check.

 

[Storyteller01]

Half-Orc PCs should get a racial trait that allows them to use their Str or Cha for their ability modifier for Intimidate.

Troy

At least amongst each other....

 

[Zweischneid]

Well, I think the problem as always is confusing charisma with physical beauty. It is not IMO.

A Paladin doesn't need to be handsome to pull his trick on a crowd of rough man-at-arms.. infact, I'd imagine most paladins with a few rough edges and a battle-scar or two.

Similarly, the clichee of an overtly pretty, oiled and perfumed fop of an aristocrat would have a very, very low charisma.
(though the dangerous version might have high charisma to boot)

So yes, an Orc (or Half-Orc) who would be imposing by his presence alone would need a high charisma.
The -2 Charisma for Orcs IMO is mostly due to D&D still working with the somewhat laughable, pig-snouted silly type of orcs and not the fearsome Tolkien kind.

 

[iwatt]

I've always wondered how charisma played into intimidate. Now call me a pansy, but if some 6'4" 280 lb horribly-scarred, foaming from the mouth half-orc (cha=6) is trying to scare the bejesus out of me, he's going to be a lot more successful then some pretty boy fancypants paladin (cha=16). I'm not sure what exactly would determine a good modifier for intimidate. Strength doesn't seem relevant either because some crazy necromancer with no str/cha could still scare me if he's doing all types of whacked out things.

No problem. The orc scares the beejesus out of me too. Doesn't mean he was able to "intimidate" me in game terms (turn his attitude to friendly for some time). Basically, a low Cha Orc either scares me so much I see no point in helping himout cause I know the maniac's going to kill me anyway. The paladin intimidates me with the suggetsoin of a terrible fate awaiting me if I don't repent and help him out.


So it's all in how you handle it.

 

[Christopher Lambert]

I've always wondered how charisma played into intimidate. Now call me a pansy, but if some 6'4" 280 lb horribly-scarred, foaming from the mouth half-orc (cha=6) is trying to scare the bejesus out of me, he's going to be a lot more successful then some pretty boy fancypants paladin (cha=16). I'm not sure what exactly would determine a good modifier for intimidate. Strength doesn't seem relevant either because some crazy necromancer with no str/cha could still scare me if he's doing all types of whacked out things.

I disagree. A Charismatic person can be scary too.

Artemis Entreri isn't a big beefy person but he can scare people who don't know that he's an assassin.

For instance:

"Entreri watched the hand coming towards him and lifted his gaze to look Josi Puddles straight in the eye, to let the man know, with just a look and just that awful, calm and deadly demeanor, that if he so much as brushed Entreri's arm with his hand, he would surely pay for it with his life."

He didn't say a word, didn't have any visible weapons, or anything like that.

 

[Storyteller01]

The -2 Charisma for Orcs IMO is mostly due to D&D still working with the somewhat laughable, pig-snouted silly type of orcs and not the fearsome Tolkien kind.

Someone tried to give an explanation as to why dwarves take a -2 hit to Charisma. It may apply here.

The interpretation had been that dwarves view their existence through their clan or family. Their sense of family unity tends to override their sense of self. The -2 represents the effect this has on the individual dwarf (or in this case orc)..

As for half orcs...well, being bounced from community to community can have that effect on a guy. Wonder why the same isn't true for half elves (pretty boys get all the luck!!)...

 

[Christopher Lambert]

Someone tried to give an explanation as to why dwarves take a -2 hit to Charisma. It may apply here.

The interpretation had been that dwarves view their existence through their clan or family. Their sense of family unity tends to override their sense of self. The -2 represents the effect this has on the individual dwarf (or in this case orc)..

As for half orcs...well, being bounced from community to community can have that effect on a guy. Wonder why the same isn't true for half elves (pretty boys get all the luck!!)...

It could be that orcs don't develop social graces (unless you think "graces" means "a boot to the head") and since half-orcs are descended from them...

Meanwhile I've always felt that half-elves are often accepted by humans and rarely by elves. A half-elf raised by humans has little reason to lose confidence; they've got that "beautiful people*" thing going for them without suffering the arrogance that elves often do. (On a similar thrust, the elves of Palladium have bonuses to "Physical Beauty" but penalties to "Mental Affinity" which is their version of Charisma.) The DMG has a little sidebar called "half-human elves" who are basically half-elves raised by elves, so I'm under the impression that only a small number of half-elves could be raised by elves. The tremendous elven racism against half-elves (this isn't from Tolkien) which is often ludicrous (Dragonlance and at least some FR novels) is a big part of this.

*Looks, voice, poetry, whatever. Not every half-elf is drop-dead gorgeous.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Intimidate is the ability to get someone to DO WHAT YOU WANT THEM TO DO BY SCARING THEM.

Being scary does not do that.

Being big, mean and scary does not do that.

Being handsome, charming and telling someone that you know where their kids go to school does.

Being big, mean, scary, and then telling your target exactly what is running through his mind does that.

Dumping your charisma gets you failed intimidate checks, and people who either run away, cower in fear, or lie to get you off their backs. Live with it.

 

[daTim]

The best example of a tiny person intimidating rough and tough characters is in Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Arc. That little creepy nazi in the glasses manages to make you scared even as he hangs up his coat.

Try to look at it from that point of view, and not purely from a physical standpoint.