Irreconcilable differences(Forked Thread: When did I stop being WotC's...)

[Dire Bare]

I have never seen anyone flamed for not liking 4e on these forums. I've seen them flamed for not liking 4e and using that as justification for insulting people who like it with the terms I laid out earlier. Can you point to me where people are flamed simply for disliking it, with no actual insults (direct or implied) towards the people that like 4e?

I'm with you Raven. I too am totally amazed at the claim that people are flamed on these boards for "simply" not liking 4e. Sure, it may have happened once or twice, but I've never seen it and I am a consummate lurker.

I have seen plenty of people make spurious and false claims about what is "wrong" with 4e based on perpetuated falsehoods, misremembered quotes, and outright bias . . . and THEN get flamed.

I have seen very little rabidly fanboyish attacks against 3e, Pathfinder, or fans of either/both. I have seen tons of rabidly fanboyish attacks against 4e and the fans of the new edition. And I have also seen a few folks oddly defensive about their imagined "4e disliker" persecution.

 

[Dire Bare]

I'm still incredulous that some folks 'remember' the switch from 2E->3E as smoother than 3E->4E. At least 4E has the same core mechanics as 3E.

True. Every edition change has brought out the nerdrage in spades. We just see more of it now online simply because more of us are online now than back in 2000 . . . and, of course, none of us were online for earlier edition changes.

The joys of improved modern communications!

 

[Imp]

I have seen plenty of people make spurious and false claims about what is "wrong" with 4e based on perpetuated falsehoods, misremembered quotes, and outright bias . . . and THEN get flamed.

Would you admit it if they didn't like your sainted game for a non-spurious, non-false reason, or is such a thing possible?

 

[ProfessorCirno]

In this thread, people trip over themselves to prove me right.

I'm not saying the 4e detractors are saints, I'm saying that both sides are snide at each other, and that both sides don't see their side doing it.

In before I'm proven right some more.

 

[Shadeydm]

Sigh point of fact rather ya like it or not this place is known second only to wotc's bords as 4e haven. I stopped posting here for many months cause I was tired of being f lammed for not liking 4e. It has got better but it still happens , alot. Play what ya like. Fork another thread to duke it out if ya need to before this one gets more derailed more and closed.

And raven your making his point by attacking him back. Let it go both of ya ok.

Yeah, I stopped posting here for a few months mainly because of the posting venom which is so clearly on display in this thread by Mourn/TLR.

Behavoir which at least back then the pro 4E crowd got a lot more leeway with than the skeptics.

Apparently this is still the case.

 

[Lanefan]

1. The D&D brand: If things were simply about prefering one system to the other, there wouldn't be an edition war. The issue is that the D&D brand has value, both to individual people and in practice within the gaming community. The fact is that the D&D brand itself is solely supporting 4E right now hurts the 3E gamer...

...and the 2e gamer, and the 1e gamer, and the 0e gamer...

My biggest complaint with 3e's release had nothing to do with changes to the rules, or the system, or the artwork; but with the fact that official support for 2e (and thus by extension 1e and 0e, as 2e was easily convertible to such) was withdrawn in favour of 3e only. No more 2e or 1e adventures in Dungeon magazine. No more pre-3e related articles in Dragon. Etc. Bloody annoying, at the time and since.

Now, the 3e community is hitting the same wall.

In my ideal world, WotC and other "official" sources would support and market the whole game; the whole D+D brand, all 5 editions (0-1-2-3-4, that's 5) with enthusiasm and pride.

It's like a car dealership. I may not be able to go to the dealer this year and buy a brand new 1997 Chrysler, but I can still take one in to said dealer and get brand-name parts and service for it.

Lanefan

 

[Hunter In Darkness]

Yeah, I stopped posting here for a few months mainly because of the posting venom which is so clearly on display in this thread by Mourn/TLR.

Behavoir which at least back then the pro 4E crowd got a lot more leeway with than the skeptics.

Apparently this is still the case.

Thanks glad to see I am not the only one. It got bad for a while I am starting to post here again, been a lurking and a few other names here since 2000 and I hate to leave but eh It happens. I just don't come as much as I used to

 

[Psion]

I'm still incredulous that some folks 'remember' the switch from 2E->3E as smoother than 3E->4E.

I remember the switch from 2e->3e as smoother than 3e->4e.

I'm not counting Erics/ENWorld, because that doesn't count.

But the attitude towards D&D on local gaming fora went from very negative to very positive upon the release of 3e. Late in the 2e days, there were routine verbal lynching of 2e, and it was very difficult to find players for 2e. This is a stark contrast to the late days of 3e before 4e's release, when the local mailing list is split about 50/50, and there were still people starting new 3e games.

At least 4E has the same core mechanics as 3E.

But represents a philosophical shift that runs deeper than a mere shift in the core mechanic.

 

[billd91]

I'm with you Raven. I too am totally amazed at the claim that people are flamed on these boards for "simply" not liking 4e. Sure, it may have happened once or twice, but I've never seen it and I am a consummate lurker.

I have seen plenty of people make spurious and false claims about what is "wrong" with 4e based on perpetuated falsehoods, misremembered quotes, and outright bias . . . and THEN get flamed.

I have seen very little rabidly fanboyish attacks against 3e, Pathfinder, or fans of either/both. I have seen tons of rabidly fanboyish attacks against 4e and the fans of the new edition. And I have also seen a few folks oddly defensive about their imagined "4e disliker" persecution.

I've seen plenty of people chime up with why they don't like 4e based on their own impressions of it, and then get dogpiled by 4e-defenders dismissing their opinions as being false claims about what's "wrong" with 4e or having some kind of outright bias.
This board has NOT been a very friendly environment for 4e criticism.

 

[Roland55]

I remember the switch from 2e->3e as smoother than 3e->4e.

I'm not counting Erics/ENWorld, because that doesn't count.

But the attitude towards D&D on local gaming fora went from very negative to very positive upon the release of 3e. Late in the 2e days, there were routine verbal lynching of 2e, and it was very difficult to find players for 2e. This is a stark contrast to the late days of 3e before 4e's release, when the local mailing list is split about 50/50, and there were still people starting new 3e games.



But represents a philosophical shift that runs deeper than a mere shift in the core mechanic.

Agreed. In spades.