Is 4e bringing new players to the game?

[nightwyrm]

I'd think having a big difference between the sale of PHB vs other supplements are not unexpected. Probably everyone in a gaming group would want their own PHB, but they'll share player supplements like martial power so each group would probably just have one or two copies of those, and finally books like Open Grave or Draconomicon would only be bought by the DM if the DM is interested in them so having only one copy max per group would be the norm.

 

[Angrydad]

Well if traffic trends on the WotC forums for the past year* are an indication, the number it's bringing into the game isn't enough to offset the numbers it turned off from the game.

*anecdotally related by someone formerly in a position to be aware of what those numbers were (which roughly correspond to the Alexa trends of the same time period for what it's worth). Trust me to trust that person I suppose for the accuracy of the claim.


Locally from what I've seen, 4e spiked and then crashed, with people going back to earlier editions, or more frequently trying other games and systems entirely. People get into D&D oftentimes because of people who are already gamers, and if a new edition sufficiently splits the market like 4e anecdotally has according to many, there are fewer people working to bring newbies into that new edition. I'm not seeing anything like the wave of new people coming into the game like I saw with 3e.

This is just my own postulating, but I'd hazard that many people didn't see the problems of 3.x as being quite as serious, or at least unintuitive, as the problems that 2nd edition presented. THAC0, lower numbers being good some of the time, etc. don't really make for a user friendly mechanic. The main issues I've heard about regarding 3.x edition have to do with players finding ways to stack magic items with spell buffs and random prestige class abilities to create craziness, but less to do with how intuitive the system is or isn't.

 

[The Little Raven]

As to my friends, I have no idea why you're gobsmacked.

Because, instead of continuing to play the version of D&D they do like, they're quitting the entire hobby because of a game they don't have to buy or play. That might strike some people, like myself, as irrational.

 

[caudor]

Three words for ya: World of Warcraft

With 4e, I've gotten two of my former D&D players to pause WoW long enough to spark their interest in D&D again. It was hard, but I don't think I would have a chance had in not been for the new version.

Overall, I think the online computer games have sucked away more players from D&D than any version of D&D will bring in. Sad, but true.

But that's a topic for another thread.

 

[Beckett]

I've seen two players brought back into the hobby via 4E this weekend. They played RPGs before, and I think one had some 3E experience, but neither has really played in the last six years.

The first joined our Friday and Saturday games. Since he was coming into ongoing campaigns, I helped him roll up characters using the Character Builder. That one application was enough to make him want to get a D&D Insider account.

The other was an old member of our group who moved off and had a family. Before the game, he seemed unsure about trying to juggle gaming with work and family. However, once we had a fighter in his hands, he picked up on things pretty quick and was having a great time.

 

[xechnao]

Since the hobby in general feeds off of D&D's table scraps, anything that's bad for D&D is bad for the hobby.

Disagree. D&D is recognized as the game of vanilla fantasy. The critical matter about fantasy is that each iconic fantasy trope can find its place among the others. And D&D caters to this. It also specializes on threats and combat-right to the point of action. But as long as there is a market for this kind of thing there will always exist games about it. There is no such super power regarding the brand name and the health of the hobby. It is true that there are MMOs or CCGs or what have you that compete with tabletops but there will always be a market for this: especially because there are more things around, tabletops have their own place-a place to be considered.
It is not a phenomena or a trend like it used to be in the 80s: it is a very solid place and this place will exist regardless of the brand's name. I guess it is also a thing of the information age.

 

[Felon]

Could you cite on this? I'd be interested to see what Mr. Dancey and others have to say. And distant second doesn't mean all that much.

Well, I didn't have the foresight to bookmark them, but if I run across them, I'll let you know. There's a thread posted here whenever we see RPG sales figures released. They generally come out with D&D being in the seventy or eighty percentile range, with White Wolf taking up most of the remainder and Palladium making a token presence.

I certainly understand people finding something else to do with their time. I was more surprised that the release of a single game system would drive someone away from the hobby. That seems kind of ludicrous to me. However, your friends have their own motivations for leaving the hobby, and I can respect that.

Because, instead of continuing to play the version of D&D they do like, they're quitting the entire hobby because of a game they don't have to buy or play. That might strike some people, like myself, as irrational.

I suspect that's because you're projecting yourself onto other peoples' set of circumstances. In this case, playing the flavor of D&D they like would mean seeking an entirely new group. Maybe it wouldn't be a big deal for you to do so, but for them it wasn't worth it. The vet has largely played with the same group of people for fifteen years or so, and the newcomer has only ever played with the one group.

For some, it's a binary equation where the only relevant factor is whether or not you want to game--and if you want to, you'll find a way. Apparently, you fall into that category. For others, it's a matter of tallying up the costs and comparing them to the benefits. And for a couple of them, a change to 4e was, like I said, the straw that broke the camel. There's nothing irrational about that.

 

[joethelawyer]

This was my next thought. If PHBII sales are anywhere near PHBI, then that shows the popularity is still going.

they never show us the actual sales figures, nor should they. i can guarantee you though that no matter what the actual figures are, they will be talked about through the official wotc reps as being fantastic.

 

[ProfessorPain]

they never show us the actual sales figures, nor should they. i can guarantee you though that no matter what the actual figures are, they will be talked about through the official wotc reps as being fantastic.

Hasbro is a public company. Getting a hold on some sales figures info shouldn't be too hard.

 

[Mistwell]

Hasbro is a public company. Getting a hold on some sales figures info shouldn't be too hard.

Yes it should. Being a public company does not mean your detailed individual sales figures are public information. In fact, they are trade secrets.

The only thing released is very general sales figures. You'd be lucky to get WOTC general figures, for example. WOTC as a division is usually barely mentioned in the quarterly reports.