D&D 5E Is 5e "Easy Mode?"

[DND_Reborn]

That's how I always saw it.

After the party leaves town, the only long rest they get is when they come back or clear an area for them to rest.

After Swordy, Staffy, Macey, and K'Nifey leave the inn, they don't get a full heal long rest unless the DM lets them or they get back.

In the old days, if the DM wanted to make them live longer, they drop extra potions.
Since 4e, you don't have to. You have healing surges or HD.

unless it's Leomond...

LEOMUND!!!!!!!!!!

That's why my dungeons always has mages.

We killed the shamans before the Wall of Force went up.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

.

No it is exactly the point, the only reason that you think that point you quoted is "not the point" is because it causes severe problems with your attempts at dismissal & gm blame. The system itself starts breaking down badly when you start doing the kinds of "the gm can just make it harder" stuff you are suggesting which results in needing to do more & more structural low level system changes to correct the cascading deluge of problems that come up as a result of an overly simplified overly streamlined system designed to mitigate all forms of risk to a thing of near zero concern. That experience point problem you dismiss so quickly is just one of the problems. Pretty quickly you've written a whole new system trying to work around careless design choices that resulted in absurd design goals that left someone thinking healing spirit was a good spell to publish as is.

I have to wonder if you've ever tried any of it, because I know from quite a lot of experience that you're completely wrong.

And I'm not blaming the DM, I'm reminding people that there are tools for them.
As for XP, milestone leveling is an official option. Use it if you don't like the pacing of the standard XP chart.

The guidelines are not necessary. Throw them out. The game won't break.

Every time I've had players stressing out over strategic and tactical choices, worried about survival, etc, in 5e, it has not involved even 4 encounters in a day. I've never run a 5e game with 6 or more encounters, nor have I literally ever seen anyone else do so. The game runs fine.

 

[Minigiant]

In reality. you really can't use LTH willy nilly AND finish quests in time until the ealiest level 9. And by then, you are bordering paragon tier.

You'll need your 3rd level slots to recast it or kill the mages.
3rd level slots don't enter "throwaway to noncombat, shenanigans, or utility" zone until you have 6th level spells.

Leomund's Stupid Hut has been a problem since 3e.

 

[Oofta]

So what is to stop the player's abusing it by simply casting Leomund's Tiny Hut every night? Sure as a DM you can purposely foil their plans but that is also a dangerous road. Sure a group of intelligent casters might take down their hut but that shouldn't be happening often under normal circumstances. That means 9 times out of 10 there is no longer ANY risk for the players to rest. Pop up a hut every night, forget about keeping watch and just sleep away.

PCs can always set up the hut in my world. The monsters like having all that time to gather reinforcements, set up traps, bury the PCs under a ton of rubble by causing a cave in and so on.

 

[Mepher]

It is just another representation of how 5E was made easier by design.

I guess it's just going to take me time to wrap my head around a new style of play. Maybe if I spend less time worrying about how fast paced the new style of play is I can just spend more time enjoying seeing some epic level play. After 3 years of running 5E it still feels wrong to me.

LMoP with Basic Rules was fun. Everyone enjoyed it.

Waterdeep Dragon Heist was probably the most fun adventure I have ever run. I added a lot of homebrew and it took 22 sessions for the players to finish it and hit level 5. Playing in an urban setting we didn't have to stress rest because it wasn't combat heavy. After Dragonheist we moved to Undermountain. I hate running it, the players hated playing it. It was night and day to DH.

That was when we took a break and went back to 2E. The problem was the players really enjoyed Waterdeep and they were not happy with 2E rules and specifially 2E healing. Once they cleared the Moathouse they wanted to come back to 5E.

Ghosts of Saltmarsh this time and it was ok. Mix of RP and Dungeons. By the time we finished Danger at Dunwater though the group asked to move back to Waterdeep. Maybe I need to put more focus on urban settings.

Anyways, back to the point... I guess a lot of this is just going to be about me finally accepting some of these changes for what they are. They aren't bad, just different. In hindsight some of them are better.

 

[Umbran]

So what is to stop the player's abusing it by simply casting Leomund's Tiny Hut every night?

"Abusing". They are giving up a fireball, lightning bolt, or similar for that. A wizard only ever gets three spell slots of 3rd level, so that's not a minor thing.

There's other consequences for camping in a threatening area than "you are attacked while you rest." You have time to heal up, sure. But so do all the monsters - they have time to heal up and prepare just like the PCs do. And you have put up this entirely visible dome in their space, so they know exactly where you are. Your monsters and NPCs don't do anything about that?

Not to mention any other issues of time pressure that may be involved.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Anyways, back to the point... I guess a lot of this is just going to be about me finally accepting some of these changes for what they are. They aren't bad, just different. In hindsight some of them are better.

LOL, when I started 5E it was from 1E/2E and I was like "What? Why they hell did they do that!?" and "That doesn't make any sense! This is the dumbest thing I have ever seen." or "Man, didn't they learn anything from 3rd editon???"

So, yeah, I know how you feel.

The crazy thing is, if you play 5E for what it is, strictly RAW even, it plays fine and you have fun IME. It isn't bad really, it is different.

It just isn't your daddy's D&D.

 

[Eric V]

Wait...can't LTH be cast as a ritual? That stops it from taking up a slot.

 

[Umbran]

....the only reason that you think ...

Mod Note:

The internet is not a good medium for telepathy. Please don't tell people why they think things. You don't actually know this, and it is rude.

 

[tetrasodium]

.

I have to wonder if you've ever tried any of it, because I know from quite a lot of experience that you're completely wrong.

And I'm not blaming the DM, I'm reminding people that there are tools for them.
As for XP, milestone leveling is an official option. Use it if you don't like the pacing of the standard XP chart.

The guidelines are not necessary. Throw them out. The game won't break.

Every time I've had players stressing out over strategic and tactical choices, worried about survival, etc, in 5e, it has not involved even 4 encounters in a day. I've never run a 5e game with 6 or more encounters, nor have I literally ever seen anyone else do so. The game runs fine.

My position is not that you can not make something difficult, it's that 5e lacks the sort of fine grained precisely targetable tools present in 5e are no longer available & that what remains is crude overly blunt hacks. I covered that earlier & even gave you examples of the sort of tools I'm referencing , to which you dismissed as being too long for more than a quick skim & clutched at "but resistance". Instead of claiming the tools exist, look at the specific problems people raise & do more than imply they are a poor gm.

"Abusing". They are giving up a fireball, lightning bolt, or similar for that. A wizard only ever gets three spell slots of 3rd level, so that's not a minor thing.

There's other consequences for camping in a threatening area than "you are attacked while you rest." You have time to heal up, sure. But so do all the monsters - they have time to heal up and prepare just like the PCs do. And you have put up this entirely visible dome in their space, so they know exactly where you are. Your monsters and NPCs don't do anything about that?

Not to mention any other issues of time pressure that may be involved.

Not by 5e's rules.